 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Miranda
Date: 2002-03-23 16:27
OK, so I downloaded some music from the internet and printed it out. But I discovered there was a note that I've never seen before. I've only been playing for 6 months but I'm pretty good. The note was an E#. Is there such thing on a Bflat clarinet? I thought you went from E to F without a sharp or flat. Please e-mail any replies. Also, I'm looking for a few good marches or shuffles to play. Mostly fast stuff!
Thanx,
Miranda, 1st Chair Clarinetist
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Author: Lori
Date: 2002-03-23 16:39
Miranda,
If you look at a keyboard, you'll notice that there is no black key between E and F (the same is true for B and C). The definition of sharp, however, is one half step higher (or on the keyboard, go one half step to the right). Therefore, an E-sharp is played the same as (or is enharmonic to) F-natural. An F-flat would be enharmonic to E-natural.
Keep up the good work and questions!
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-03-23 16:41
Wind instrument players have it easy, Miranda;
E# = F, Fb = E
:]
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Author: John O'Janpa
Date: 2002-03-23 16:41
Miranda,
When you play an E#, it is up one half step from an E, so it is played the same as an F. Likewise, if you run across a B#, it is played the same as a C.
Don't see them real often, but they happen from time to time.
This is true for any instrument, not just clarinets.
Hope someone else can find you some marches or shuffles.
John
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-03-23 22:14
Are people not taught theory anymore?
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Author: Roger -- the other one
Date: 2002-03-23 23:46
diz, the Lass did say she had only been playing for six months ---
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Author: Jim E.
Date: 2002-03-24 05:50
Wind players are at a disadvantage when learning basic theory because it is not laid out visually for us as it is on the keyboard (and mallet) instruments. We also think of music horizontally rather than vertically since we can't play chords (at least not alone!)
Miranda,
The reason for this is that the major scale (doe, ray, mi etc.) is not all whole steps, but follows the pattern of:
whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half
In C Major (no sharps and flats) the half steps occur between e & f, and again between b & c.
I remember this really confusing me when I started a ways back (JFK was president then. I'd say I was an old timer, but some of the folk on this board have reeds that are older than me!)
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Author: Jeff Forman
Date: 2002-03-24 15:16
I look at it another way. As Jim said, the major scale takes the progression of whole step whole step half step whole step whole step whole step half step. And when you say the notes of the scale, you want to say each of the letters one time so you know what the treatment of that note is in that key.
So for instance, in the key of C, it is C D E F G A B C, in the key of G it is G A B C D E F# G, etc. And while you are right that there is technically no E#, the problem comes in when you talk about the key of F#. The notes (using the W-W-H-W-W-W-H progression) would be F# G# A# B C# D# F F#. And that means you didn't use the letter "E", you used F twice. So in the key of F# is F a natural or is it sharped? And how is the note E treated in the key of F#? The answers are that in the key of F# the F is sharped and the E is sharped. So even though E# "doesn't exist" in the key of F# when you get to an E note, you need to raise it a half step.
Maybe the classical trained folks will disagree, but that is one way to look at the issue.
Jeff
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-03-24 21:12
Most folks will not disagree with you, Jeff, they'll just be overwhelmed. You've laid out a verrrry complicated answer to a very straightforward question :|
E# = F, Fb = E
B# = C, Cb = B
None of us, including myself, has bothered to look for some shuffles and marches recommendations.
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Author: Forest Aten
Date: 2002-03-26 06:34
Ron,
It is very important realize that an E# is an E# is an E#....not an F. E# is enharmonic with F and this is not E#=F. Notation is the issue.
Putting this extra mental step in place is unnecessary and will profoundly impact your ability to read notation.
You should think:
E#=fingering
Not:
E#=F=fingering
Knowing and understanding enharmonics is important...but has little to do with reading notation. If I had to constantly go through the mental rig-a-ma-role you propose for E#, I would often be left in the dust by my peers at the professional level. (or miss notes in an effort to keep up)
I do know and understand that E# "sounds" the same as F...but again E# is not F. When I "see" E#, I play and think E#...not F. Sitting where I'm sitting, notes often go by fast....every millisecond is important to the eye/brain/reaction equation. Using a transposition for enharmonics is not a good way to save on milliseconds.
Give it some thought. It might save you a wrong note played somewhere in the future.
Regards,
F. Aten
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Author: LynnB
Date: 2002-03-26 22:13
and then there's the double-flats and double-sharps (but we won't go there :-D)
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Author: George
Date: 2002-03-28 15:36
While this is unusual notation, you will probably find that it was used to avoid having to use a natural on a (or many) subsequent F's in the same measure. In short, for simplicity of notation.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2002-03-28 22:42
It is not just used for simplicity of notation but often for accurate representation of the note's place in harmonic structure of the piece. An A major chord for example is A, C#, E. Now if you have an A major augmented chord it is A, C#, E#. It would be the wrong chord "spelling" to use an F.
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