 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Denis
Date: 2002-02-09 16:21
I have an old wooden B-flat? clarinet with no markings other than
"Harmonia" Paris Artiste
Made in France
I could not find a serial number, but I bought it used about 25 years ago. I can't find anybody who's ever heard of this maker to see if it's worth overhauling for my daughter to learn to play. Any info is appreciated!
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Author: Teri
Date: 2002-02-09 17:08
Yeah, I looked it up. The clarinet in question belongs to my husband, who is a flute/sax player himself. The clarinet is in a Selmer case, but that is probably meaningless. He says it could be that the clarinet was made in a factory and stamped with a private label by a renegade factory worker! Any way to tell if it's worth overhauling for a student (our daughter) to learn to play. I may be a complete ignoramus (non woodwind player), but it seems to me that paying $250-300 to overhaul a wooden clarinet with no cracks in fairly good shape would be better than buying a $300 plastic (composite) student model. My husband says that there seems to be a leak in the lower section of the instrument but that the mouthpiece is pretty good. What say you?
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Author: Dee
Date: 2002-02-09 17:59
Unfortunately it is impossible to tell how good it is until you get it into playing condition since it is not known what company made it. By the way the practice of "stenciling" is quite common. Many companies make instruments under contract to various distributors and label them with the distributors mark. So it doesn't mean it was a "renegade" factory worker.
The misconception that wood is better than plastic is all too common. The truth of the matter is that professional instruments (most but not all of which are made of wood) are better than beginner grade instruments (most but not all of which are made of plastic) and it is not a function of material. For example a Buffet Greenline ( a "filled" plastic using sawdust) will be better than wooden Pan American (an old student model that was a real dog).
The true difference is in the design. Student horns are designed to be easy to play, rugged, and cheap to make. This leads to less than stellar playing qualities and sound regardless of the material. Pro horns are designed to have great playing qualities.
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-02-09 18:11
There are NO complete ignoramus (non woodwind player)s here, Teri. There are some non woodwind players and most of us are friends... or, at least friendly to some degree 
Your question is a good one as others will no doubt benefit from some of the answers it generates.
Forget about the 'brand name'. Mark immediately got That question outta the way
It has no bearing on your particular situation.
If I may paraphrase, your question is -- 'Are no-name, somewhat decent, older wood clarinets worth fixing up to make 'em playable?' You say it has no cracks and is in fairly good condition. I assume that means it hasn't been left out in the rain overnight too often or otherwise severely abused or neglected during its lifetime.
Well, to begin with... $250-300 is waaay too much money to pay for a (routine) clarinet overhaul. That'd buy a total restoration. You don't need that. You may as well put a down payment on a new instrument for that kinda cash. The going overhaul rates are more in the $120-170 range. Two-fifty/three hundred bucks would take care of an alto sax, alto or bass(?) clarinet or my grand-dad's silver sarrusaphone, etc.
Personally, I find no reason not to fix the instrument. New pads (some or all), corks likewise, proper adjustment and you'll likely have a pretty good instrument. Has your husband tried tootin' it recently? If it plays at all, it may only need general (as needed) servicing. Most folks here recommend having it checked out by a qualified repair technician anyway, just to make sure it's working right before your daughter attempts to play it. Nothing's worse than trying to learn on a horn that's not working right. After taking care of that concern, it'll certainly be a good instrument to get her started playing. Later, after a couple of months or so, you might want to consider investing in a mouthpiece. She'll be ready then, if she stays with it, to select one suited more individually to her embouchure etc.
Thanks for posting your question, Denis, Teri. That's how we find out about things around here :]
- ron b -
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Author: Marge
Date: 2002-02-09 18:24
Interesting--I have an old hard-rubber B-flat clarinet with a similar name (but not the same) that dates at least to the 1930s. I've always wondered about its origins. Its stencils say "Harmony Paris C.M.I. Co." and very faintly above that "L.P." above a "B." Anybody know anything about this one?
My uncle bought it secondhand c. 1934-35, to play in his high school band and, until it became too time-consuming, the U. of Michigan band. Supposedly, it had been bought new for a spoiled little rich boy who soon tired of the clarinet. Thereafter, it sat in my grandparents' attic until about 1953, when I got it and played it through high school and college, then again off and on in the 1970s and 80s, and steadily from about 1992 in our community marching band until about 1998, when I started using a plastic Vito. Anybody ever heard of this one?
Also, might anybody know how to improve the exterior appearance of the hard rubber, which has some spots and streaks (lighter, sort of greenish-brown), evidently due to some sprinkles I played through while marching (probably before whipping out the plastic bag I always carry in a pocket, then stopping playing)? Some of the moisture streaks can be seen on the inside of the bell also.
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Author: Marge
Date: 2002-02-09 18:45
Thanks, Mark! I should have mentioned originally that my family lived in Chicago, which explains the C.M.I. Co. part, at least (Chicago Musical Instrument Co.). They must have had the hard-rubber Harmony model clarinet made for them in Paris?
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Author: Marge
Date: 2002-02-09 18:49
Was just going to put a note under the thread Mark started for Chicago Musical Instrument Co. also. And I wanted to print what Mark said. It WAS just above this posting on the main BB page, but then it disappeared and I can't get it back, even with reloading from the server, several times. Where did it go?
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-02-09 19:32
For a very old clarinet still to be around, not having been used to decorate a wall, support a lamp, or stoke a fire, someone must have enjoyed playing it. While I'd go ahead and have it brought up to good playing condition, I agree with ron b that you should spend much less than $250 to have the necessaries done -- like maybe half that. Unless, of course, the instrument has some major discrepancy (such as badly cracked wood), in which case you'd need to think twice about repairing it.
Regards,
John
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-02-09 20:06
Marge -
Laundry bleach and water solution, about 50-50, works pretty well on some discolored mouthpieces. Dip the mpc, except the cork (unless you're going to re-cork it), for an hour or two, then rinse the mpc with warm running water. It helps. It might help a plastic instrument body too although I've never tried it. You'd have to do it during an overhaul while all the keys are removed. Dry well and lightly oil the springs and pivots afterward. I've overhauled a couple of very old Conns that had turned greenish brown. I lightly sanded, then (also lightly) machine buffed the bodies. The green wasn't entirely gone but it was hardly noticeable. It took an extra hour or so to do this but they turned out okay.
- ron b -
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Author: Ashley
Date: 2002-02-10 16:04
I found a wooden clarinet at a swapmeet, a Selmer Signet Special. It was a very good find at $50 and it worked! (well it held out for 3 weeks then $145 worth of work had to be done on it but...almost a complete overhaul) When I took it to be fixed I couldn't find a serial number on it anywhere. I was quite puzzled at this because I have another Selmer Signet Special that does have a serial number on it. The swapmeet find has no other identifying marks other than the Selmer insignia etched in it. It doesn't bother me that it doesn't have a serial number on it but I am a little curious about where it came from. How would I track this down???
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Author: Teri
Date: 2002-02-11 00:42
Thanks everybody for all the info. You clarinetists sure are a friendly and helpful lot!
The $250 was an L.A. boutique "horn repair guru to the stars" price; it included buffing the oxidized silver keys which are now a dull greyish color to a sparkly new condition. However I assume this is an aesthetic issue and not a playability issue. It certainly is outside the scope of a kid's first clarinet--at least until we know she's going to stick with it.
She can already make a decent sound with the darn thing even in its current state, though. I tried it, got dizzy and almost passed out. Guess I'll stick to piano accompaniment.
The only other place we know of in and around the L.A. area is Baxter Northrup, a huge music store.
Know of any inspiring clarinet CDs we could get? We already are getting sick of Rhapsody in Blue (Just kidding), which got her interested in clarinet in the first place! Someone suggested Mozart's Clarinet Quintet and also one by Brahms for classical. But for some reason, I always think of jazz when I think clarinet...
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Author: Jim E.
Date: 2002-02-11 03:53
You may want to check John Butler's web site, link to it from the sponsors page. He lists his full price schedule for a variety of services on clarinet and other instruments.
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