 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-11-20 02:58
I recently found a Buffet Crampon E11 clarinet on Facebook marketplace for $50. It looks to have been well cared for in its lifetime but the person whom I bought it from was not a player and didn't know anything about it. I didn't ask where she got it. It has made in w- Germany stamped on the back, SN# 406xxx. I believe it is wood with silver plated keys but I'm not positive. Any other info that anyone would know about it, such as year made etc would be helpful. I've tried to look it up by serial number but couldn't find anything. I do not play but my son does. He's a senior in high school and has been playing the same clarinet since 5th grade which he pieced together from random parts in a box at a flea market (unbranded). He's incredibly talented and has been dying for an upgrade.
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-11-20 03:08
Is there a way you can post photographs here for us? We can tell a lot about the instrument from some pics- also, for the price of $50 it would STILL be a good deal if you had to pay for a complete repad... I can see why you are being cautious- that's a pretty low price (but such bargains are not unheard of- a former student of mine got an E11 in quite playable condition for about $150 US$ a few years back).
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2022-11-20 03:45
That's one of the older E11s from the '80s - it's wood with nickel plated keys. The plating has worn though in the usual spots, but that's typical for these clarinets (as well as the B12 below it and the E13 above) and doesn't impact on how they play.
For $50, it's definitely worth buying and then having fully overhauled with all new pads (leather, cork or synthetic pads or a mixture of them, but NOT skin pads), key corks and tenon corks and done to a high standard.
Check the cost of a brand new E11 and you'll find the cost to buy this one for $50 plus the cost of an overhaul will be considerably less and these older E11s are much better built than new ones.
It's worth doing and don't fall into the trap of thinking "It only cost $50 so I'm not prepared to spend several hundred on having it overhauled" as it doesn't work like that - the value of this clarinet exceeds its purchase price. The insurance an d replacement value is that of a brand new E11 and not the $50 it can be bought for.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2022-11-20 03:47)
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-11-20 03:50
Thank you for the reply. I've already bought and received it. I just want to be able to give my son details on it when I give it to him. He was dreaming of a nice yamaha.
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2022-11-20 13:10
A good wood clarinet care kit will be helpful to clean it up a bit. It should include a mouthpiece brush, key brush/pipe cleaner for tone holes, swab(s), and other things.
I would use a wool clarinet swab and dampen the swab with bore oil. I'd lightly coat the outside of the clarinet with it, but don't let it set into the pads. I'd also actually oil the bore (inside) of the clarinet by pulling the swab through it several times. Let it dry overnight, then use a standard cotton or silk swab afterwards.
For the keys, get Flitz. That can do wonders! You can get it on Amazon and just follow the instructions.
https://www.amazon.com/Flitz-Plastic-Fiberglass-1-76-Ounce-Blister/dp/B000MUSOW4/
For ongoing tarnishing, get a good jewelry silver cleaning and polishing cloth. This was what I bought for my new clarinet:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09TPTYFVZ
Just my thoughts.
Getting back into playing after 20 years.
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Vandoren M15 Profile 88 (non-13) mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren blue-box #3.5 reeds
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2022-11-20 15:54
The outside of these clarinets is lacquered, so there's no need to oil the surface. DON'T use metal polish on the mechanism in a bid to polish the nickel plate as that will get into where it shouldn't and will bind up the mechanism if it's done with the keys still on. I've seen this time and time again and it's no fun in having to free up keywork bound up solid with metal polish (as well as using the wrong oil), so please don't let this clarinet become a statistic.
I'd only recommend you have it cleaned and oiled by a specialist repairer as part of the overhaul which it desperately needs than doing anything yourself as the pads are all toast as are all the key corks if it's never been serviced or overhauled in all its time, which is now over 35 years old.
The nickel plated keywork will need machine polishing once all the pads and key corks have been removed if you want it all restored to a bright finish, although that won't restore the worn spots which would need the affected keys to be replated which isn't really necessary as machine polishing them will make the worn spots less conspicuous.
The RH thumbrest is on upside down, but that's easy enough for the repairer to flip round and making sure they don't strip the screw threads in the process.
My recommendation is to leave it to the professionals rather than doing anything yourself if you've got no experience as using the wrong cleaning agent or ill-fitting screwdrivers will only cause more harm.
While it may not be a shiny new Yamaha, it can be made all nice and shiny and also better finished and better playing than any brand new equivalent model clarinet once all the work is done (it's the same level clarinet as a Yamaha YCL-450). It'll all be worth it when it's done.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-11-22 03:07
I dropped it off today at the specialist's shop. I had them look it over first and they said a $100 service will get it cleaned up, the bad corks and bad pads replaced. My son did play it the other day before we took it down and it sounded beautiful.i can only imagine how it will sound in 2-3 weeks when we get it back.
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2022-11-22 03:08
I wish I could hit a 'like' button.
Getting back into playing after 20 years.
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Vandoren M15 Profile 88 (non-13) mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren blue-box #3.5 reeds
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-11-22 06:31
He's a senior in high school and just recently started some private clarinet lessons. He's in our county's youth symphony orchestra which provides scholarships for private lessons. We don't have much and can't really afford to pay for any. He worked over the summer and saved up the money to do it. He has been in concert band in school since 4th grade. He did marching band on clarinet a couple years but switched to tenor drums/ bagpipes for Marching Band. He also plays piano in the school's rock band. He's been in County band/ chorus every year since he was old enough as well as districts and regionals for both band and chorus. Music comes easily and naturally for him.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2022-11-22 18:57
Schreiber also made Buffet E11 clarinets in the key of A, thereby making A clarinets more affordable and accessible to players who couldn't stretch to a pro level A clarinet for orchestral use (just as B&H made Edgware A clarinets which the E11 is the successor of after B&H ceased clarinet production).
And also E11 clarinets in C and Eb for the same reasons. I never understood why Schreiber never offered plastic Eb and C clarinets under the B12 model name as that would've brought reliable and well-built Eb and C clarinets to more players.
If he's doing orchestral playing, then keep an eye out for an E11 in A - they were even supplied with a single case as well as a Buffet double case, although they're much better off in the single case as all the joints are kept separate instead of the bells remaining on the lower joints which compresses the tenon corks or can cause the bells to bind on solid in a worst case scenario. The Buffet E13 in A was also offered which was the first of the Buffet-built Buffet clarinets and the model above the E11 - the older E13s from the late '80s and early '90s also had nickel plated keywork which wore off in the usual spots.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-11-22 20:31
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Thanks Chris, I will have to keep an eye out. I'm excited for this to get back out of the shop just to see him play it. It was supposed to be a Christmas present but with this being his senior year and multiple concerts and auditions before Christmas, we decided to give it to him early. The absolute joy on his face was incredible. I know he's counting the days till it's done in the shop.
Now what about Evette clarinets? Do you guys know anything about them? I was given this one today. It says made in west Germany, serial number 700xx. The guy didn't think it was worth selling for anything and really looks like someone did an awful job of repadding it once. It's been sitting for like 10 years apparently. My son was hoping for a clarinet repair kit for Christmas. I was thinking this might be something he could experiment with, learn, and work on. What are your thoughts?
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Author: Hunter_100
Date: 2022-11-22 20:32
E11's benefit greatly from a replacement barrel that is slightly longer than the stock one which will probably play quite sharp.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2022-11-22 21:13
The plastic Evettes became the B&H Regent II and then the Buffet E11 and are essentially plastic versions of the wooden Evette/Buffet E11. Wooden Evettes are the forerunners to the E11 - both clarinets were made by Schreiber and the early E11s have the same keywork as the Evettes which is much better than the later ones from the late '90s onwards.
It would definitely be an ideal clarinet to learn the basics of repair techniques on if he has the aptitude for it. And if he takes well to doing his own repairs and develops his repair skills, then there's always a world of instrument repair ahead of him if he chooses to take that career path alongside playing. The added bonus being a clarinet player/repairer is he'll have a much better idea of what works, what feels right and what to do to improve things.
One big thing to be cautious with plastic clarinets is plastic melts very easily, so take a lot of care when using a gas torch or bunsen burner when adjusting pads on them whilst the keys are on.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2022-11-22 21:17)
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-12-14 17:01
I just wanted to let everyone know that the E11 was done yesterday afternoon, just in time for my son's school concert. He was over the moon thrilled and loves it. He's been playing it nonstop since he got home from school yesterday. The mouthpiece is old and worn so he's been using his other mouthpiece but there's such an incredible difference. I'm not sure if posting links is permitted but here's a quick video from the concert last night. My son is the clarinet in the group of soloists up front, playing New Orleans Jazz Funeral (starts slow and ends fast).
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02N2qEmJyh9dDXPsZ1tMQ5K86MM1muUyn9ELuosve2WVxTXZuJwaKCMcEzqauB52MDl&id=100000809582857&mibextid=Nif5oz
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Author: smokindok
Date: 2022-12-14 19:49
Excellent! Glad it all worked out so well.
Thank you for coming back with the update and that delightful clip of your son and his bandmates! Too often someone will show up on this board asking a question, will get very good information from many experienced and knowledgeable board members, and then just disappear, without any acknowledgement of the assistance or explanation of how things played out.
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-12-14 23:49
Thanks for letting everyone know, super happy to hear it worked out well! (especially as I encounter loads of students who get all petulant over playing a 2nd hand instrument, nice to hear how happy he is!)
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-12-15 00:36
I appreciate all of the advice, information, and support you all have given! It's been greatly appreciated. I thought it only fair to come back and share the end result
donald wrote:
> Thanks for letting everyone know, super happy to hear it worked
> out well! (especially as I encounter loads of students who get
> all petulant over playing a 2nd hand instrument, nice to hear
> how happy he is!)
My kids are very down to earth with certain things. They don't care if something is second hand. If it works, that's what they care about. In this case, it works beautifully and still looks wonderful. My son even made the comment of not wanting to touch it without a pair of clarinet gloves lol.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2022-12-15 04:24
Thanks for letting us know the outcome and good to see and hear in the video he's enjoying playing his new old clarinet too.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: pinkcellophane
Date: 2022-12-19 21:36
I just started playing again after 20 yrs and play in 2 community bands. Worked my way up and play 1st chair in both. Good for you- Good luck!!
504 913 6912
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2022-12-25 19:07
Merry Christmas all! My son played his clarinet at the Christmas Eve service with his piano teacher and her daughter (flute). He messed up a couple times but they only had a chance to run through the music twice before hand and he didn't get time to practice on his own. Still sounded beautiful.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02qCCFFKdCURxDG1j3umqYgUKoqXf1D469Jbfj6dY1mcwExXdoJSCF915XrGrn8Egsl&id=100000809582857&mibextid=Nif5oz
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Author: Cl@rinetMom
Date: 2023-02-11 18:11
Popping in for an update. District band was last night. My son got first chair in his section and will be moving on to regionals. His best friend and another of his close friends also got first in their sections.
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Author: jim sclater
Date: 2023-09-20 17:24
Just another example why this list is such an important resource. Thanks to you all for the help and advice you gave this mom and her son.
jsclater@comcast.net
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Author: moma4faith
Date: 2023-09-22 03:11
So happy that your son has a wonderful instrument! Those older E-11s are very much preferred by me as a teacher to the newer ones. The left hand pinky keys are a one piece design on your E-11. The newer instruments have a two piece construction that is not as well made. Also, the tone holes on the newer E-11s have plastic drop-ins instead of being actually carved from the wood. You got a great deal on a great instrument that he can enjoy for years to come!
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