 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Mirko996
Date: 2016-06-17 23:52
Attachment: Previous Embouchoure.JPG (250k)
Attachment: Previous Embouchoure 2.JPG (211k)
Attachment: Actual Embouchoure.JPG (251k)
Attachment: Actual Embouchoure 2.JPG (229k)
Hi everyone.
I will tell my story in brief.
I have started to play the clarinet since 2011. I was eleven and I started in the musical band. I had a education about to play the clarinet and the mechanics but my teacher, and subsequent, they never fix my embouchure.
How did i discover my embouchure was wrong?
Simply. Everytime I bite my below lips and I hurted myself, especially in every high note to C#6, and they aren't so hard to do, but everytime I did C#6 it started the harmonics, not only in velocity.
So... I stated to think this: If i have difficoulty to play altissimo register there will be a reason, no? It's not the mouthpiece or the clarinet, but is the basic.
I found some different kind of embouchure which are similiar, and I watched clarinettis' embouchure like Pee Wee Russel, Tony Scott, Buddy DeFranco, Giora Feidman [...] and they aren't so different. So I tried to imitate the "real" embouchure put the innerpart of the lips outside. and It started to hurt my lower lips like the first time I played the clarinet and the notes are very very out of tune and i didn't lose my virtuosism. aftert it started to form the callus. Now i'm playing with this embouchure, I don't any problem, it's rarely. The altissimo note now are more good than in the past, it's very rare I do harmonics, and I play with more virtuosism the altissimo note to G6 but I had some problem to reach C7 and the Highest note I reached before like A7 etc... But It's not my first aim to reach the super altissimo register, I want to reach C7 without problem and quietly with a scale, but I'm not completely sure if i'm taking the corret embouchure or not. I'll attach some photo, so can you tell me what can I fix and if I have to fix or not.
Thanks Very Much.
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-06-18 00:39
Mirko, in my humble opinion, the pictures that displayed your original embouchure are closer to what I would associate with a correct embouchure.
It almost seems like, and I don't say this to be critical, but rather to use an analogy that might be understood, that your lower lip assumes a posture in your current embouchure not much different than that made when people pose for pictures with "duck" faces. Generally, I just can't endorse this.
Pain or ineffective play, both of which you've reported may certainly be signs of bad embouchure, but not necessarily.
Sometimes students are using a strength of reed too hard for their abilities or the openness of the mouthpiece they're playing on, particularly at its tip, and/or just biting too hard.
I could not surmise the make and model of the mouthpiece you're using by looking at your attached pictures. Do you know this information and can you share it, along with reed make, model and strength you're using?
It almost seems like--correct me if I am wrong--that you have developed a sore on the inside of your lower lip. Such clarinet related injuries result from the pressure of the lower front teeth on this area, that come as a result of using a setup that is just too hard and/or biting too hard. This is addressed primarily by switching to an mouthpiece with a smaller tip opening, and/or the use of weaker reeds, and proper instruction on embouchure formation and strength.
I wonder if your more recent embouchure change was motivated by your need to address this discomfort.
Still more, even though you may or may not be forming the correct embouchure, please appreciate that the bite associated with this mouth formation should pretty much remain constant irrespective of the notes being played.
Many good things about how to form a proper embouchure have been written on this bboard (try the search feature) and the internet. While you search this, and others hopefully chime in here, let me leave you with information on how much of the mouthpiece to take in.
Smart players take in as much mouthpiece as they can until they squeak. They then back off a hair, and THAT is your correct amount of mouthpiece to take it.
Of course this is based on the idea that a correct embouchure has first grabbed the mouthpiece. An incorrect one my mistake the amount of mouthpiece to grab.
To summarize, it may not be the original embouchure that can take blame for your injuries. It may be that you're biting too hard, or playing too hard a reed for the mouthpiece your using, for example.
Also, two basic schools of embouchure are used by players of clarinet: single and double lip. I mention this (as my advice pertain to single lip) simply because you mentioned examining some famous artist's embouchures, some of which may have been double lip.
Trying to form a composite of both in your style and at your level may lead to bad outcomes--as much as advanced players have been known to do this for reasons way beyond scope here.
Good luck.....
Do you take private lessons? Can you?
Post Edited (2016-06-18 00:42)
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2016-06-18 00:45
You can't learn an embouchure by looking at pictures of other players. The first 2 attachment photos certainly look more correct than the last 2. However you really need to go to a proficient teacher to get your embouchure fixed or at the very least work with a good and experienced player who can see and hear what you are doing, ask you questions and interact in real time.
I seriously do not think a forum discussion can work effectively on a matter like this.
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Author: Mirko996
Date: 2016-06-18 00:52
Hi.
I have no money to take private lessons. The problem i don't do corretly the note is the embouchoure and not the reeds or the mouthpiece. I usually use 7JB and it's a open mouthpiece for my musical genre, but in this period i'm using B40. I saw on internet I shouldn't bite, but i have to use the lips. In the past i didn't use any lips, so why I did the incorrect harmonics. The previous embouchure was incorrect because the air didn't go out very well, now is comes better, but i think the actual embochoure isn't completely correct. it's like "Duck" how you said before. I should find a middle way. I tried to search, but are more are completely different than other...
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Author: Mirko996
Date: 2016-06-18 01:19
Norman,
The first two are incorrect. I said before I had problem with harmonics with this because I hurt myself...
It's better i play with myself, because now i'm confused.
Thanks very much to the help", bye.
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Author: Wes
Date: 2016-06-18 03:55
The first two looked right.
1. Open the mouth.
2. Stretch the lower lip over the bottom teeth.
3. Place reed with instrument over the bottom teeth.
4. Close the mouth with upper teeth on mouthpiece.
5. Bring the upper lip around mouthpiece to prevent air leaking.
6. Blow air.
Why is this so complicated?
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2016-06-18 03:57
Your second two look VERY similar to a traditional jazz sax embouchure. Which may be why the people you mentioned you imitated (mostly jazz artists) used it.
I know money for lessons you said is tight, but tom ridenour and a few others have excellent YouTube videos to show formation of an embouchure.
That said, if your current embouchure (the one labeled "correct"), gives you the sound, control, comfort and endurance you want, who am I to recommend changing it? If you're still lacking in one of those areas, check out some YouTube clips.
Alexi
Ps - the first embouchure is more similar to what I use, and the second embouchure I use on sax for a jazzy sound with a slightly light reed. For sax and a more classical sound, I do curl my lip over my bottom teeth more and use a slightly stiffer reed (by about 1/2 strength).
US Army Japan Band
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