 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: John
Date: 2000-10-15 05:01
Hi, just wanted to know whether anyone has tried a pomarico crystal mouthpiece. The B- flat clarinet mouthpieces come in either bright or mellow chamber. Can someone tell me whether there is a difference in the tone due to the bright/mellow chamber?
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Author: Tony M
Date: 2011-12-10 07:06
No one ever answered John's question back when and I'd like to ask it again in case the intervening years have been instructive to anyone (and also becasue I'm about to buy a Pomarico mpc).
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-12-10 12:09
I have not played the two side by side but the idea behind the whole mellow thing is to give a deeper baffle (the 'slide looking surface' as you peer into mouthpiece top down, tip facing you) and/or a bigger tone chamber (that whole area to include making the side walls further apart by angling them out toward the side rails). This also affects the PITCH of the mouthpiece affecting the notes of the clarinet closest to the the physical top of the horn. So you want to be careful about the balance between wanting a sound with less overtones and one that may actually throw off the internal pitch of your whole horn.
It doesn't appear that the Pomarico difference is enough to cause a problem in this respect, so no need to worry. Although in 2000 there was no such thing as the Black Crystal and those are marketed as all being more mellow to start with.
......................Paul Aviles
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2011-12-12 02:04
I've been playing crystal Pomaricos for years on a variety of instruments - Eb and Bb/A soprano and alto and bass clarinets, and alto and tenor saxes.
I have felt in necessary to reface every single one of them because I didn't think the factory facings were very good.
Other than that, I like them a lot (obviously) -- but then again, I can reface them and you can't (no nanny-nanny-boo-boo intended).
I've also had or have quite a few Pomarica-made crystals sold under other brands, such as Selmer Clarion and GG, plus a few O'Briens, and RIA (also Italian but possibly not made by Pomarico), and a Vandoren crystal (again not sure if it was made by Pomarico, but I don't believe it was).
I've NEVER found a crystal mouthpiece that played right for me as received. But after refacing, most of my best mouthpieces have been, or are, crystals.
Not sure what to make of all this trivia.........
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Author: oca
Date: 2011-12-12 03:08
Back in the year 2000.... Where is our lost John and what has he become now?
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Author: Tony M
Date: 2011-12-12 05:02
"Other than that, I like them a lot (obviously) -- but then again, I can reface them and you can't (no nanny-nanny-boo-boo intended)." and that wasn't how I took it. But the serious point is, is it difficult for a competent technician to reface a crystal mouthpiece?
I live in Brisbane and the idea of sending and returning mpcs international gets overweighed with the idea of play what you can get. I could ask the technician I use but he sells Pomaricos and again economics come into play (Australian prices are radically higher than sending to Weiner's for one). So I'm likely to get one from the US and then try to get it refaced if it isn't on the money when it arrives. Back to the question: are they difficult to reface? What I've read in previous posts suggests that they are more difficult than hard rubber but to what degree is not clear.
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Author: Buster
Date: 2011-12-12 06:42
Tony M,
They are more difficult to reface than rubber due to the nature of the material. Quite obviously it is a much "harder" substance: thus it requires more force to remove material/re-lay the curve. It takes a fairly delicate balance of force and finesse to work successfully with crystal/glass. (Consequently this seems to be the reason they generally arrive "from the factory" radically inconsistent.)
The other part of refacing that has not been mentioned is the alteration of the chamber and baffle. Often, simply changing the facing on any mouthpiece is insufficient; the internal dimensions need to work in concert. I think that is where the true difficulty lies. Much care must be taken in changing window size, baffle modifications and the like, as the material will chip if worked improperly----- but some degree of force is required to remove it.
I have done a few for myself, using some diamond abrasives for the internal modifications; coupled with much patience (and caffeine deprivation.)
Some refacers won't touch them, as the risk of "chippage" is present even with great care. Others are more willing to dive in.
I don't know what options/access to skilled mouthpiece craftsmen you have down under so I cannot speak on those matters. (and that is not a category I place myself in.)
-Jason
Post Edited (2011-12-12 06:46)
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Author: denkii
Date: 2011-12-12 22:52
Just curious, but what exactly does the glass/crystal change in the tone? I've only heard people say that it's more resistant, but that really doesn't seem like a good thing to me haha.
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Author: Buster
Date: 2011-12-13 00:28
A lot of the resistance that is present is due to the poor facings applied at the "factory."
Also, with many crystals that I've had pass through my hands, the window dimensions were suspect. That is a tricky issue to fix as the edges of the window are quite susceptible to "chippage" with adjustment. It can be done, but patience and a "gentle" touch is required.
Many will state that crystal has the tendency to darken (or remove some upper harmonics) from the sound. I believe that is true to a some point, but some of the perceived tonal changes I do think may be a effect of a feed-back loop: what the ear hears in comparison to the "internal vibrations" you sense (or lack thereof) from the mouthpiece itself. (My good hard rubber mouthpieces offer more "internal feedback" than crystal.) To experience this to some extent, play a hard rubber mouthpiece double-lip and a general idea can be gleaned.
As for direct effect on sound, I do think it is over-stated. Issues of mechanical and acoustical impedance can be used to explain small differing tonal qualities- but intelligent adjustment can exploit this issues for differing means.
------------------
It may seem as if I am dodging the question a bit, but I guess to sum it up I would say:
Crystal does tend to darken the sound a bit due to some inescapable qualities of the material itself. My very-good hard rubber mouthpieces offer a different experience and end-result. (Some say they sound more "noisy" internally due to the higher presence of upper harmonics; but they conversely do offer a bit more intensity in the hall.) Yet, it is an inter-play of dimensions with material.
Most cannot hear the differences out in the hall; and though present, it is subtle- thus the lack of perception by most.
All of this ignores the fact that the player is responsible for making the mouthpiece work, no matter what the material is.
-Jason
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