 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-14 15:33
Just had a clarinet (early Selmer 10S) I previously rebuilt several months back come back to me as the owner kept it assembled so the tenons stuck and the tenon corks shrunk. Not only that, he 'cleaned' the corks with a pot scourer so now the tenons have been rounded off at the ends when they were previously as sharp as the day they were made, so now they all rock and the bell tenon cork has been worn through in places down to the wood.
He rarely used the case and would carry it around in two halves wrapped in a towel (and that's how he brought it along to me earlier). He thought all the constant assembly/disassembly would cause problems such as straining the keywork or wearing the tenon corks.
The point being - after playing, taking it all apart, cleaning and drying it all out properly, PUT THE BLOODY THING BACK IN ITS CASE - THAT'S WHAT CASES WERE INVENTED FOR!
Don't use harsh abrasives to 'clean' anything with and always use a decent cork grease - NOT butter or even those lipstick ones. IF the tenons do bind in the sockets, GET IT SORTED IMMEDIATELY and NOT left for things to get worse, and unless you know what you're doing, DON'T attempt to try and fit tight tenons yourself as you'll make a complete pig's ear of it - it's always easier to remove too much wood than to replace it. If you know full well things aren't right, get things seen to at the earliest opportunity - NEVER LEAVE THINGS TOO LATE!
I've taken the time effort to do my job to my best ability and now it's your turn to respect that and do your job properly to be sure things stay that way. I'm sure all repairers will echo this thought.
Rant over.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: salzo
Date: 2010-09-14 15:43
It is your job to make sure you tell your clients EVERYTHING about the instrument-what you can do, and what you can not do.
A few years ago I had a student, went to his house to do a lesson, and mommy siad:
"We have a slight problem"
"Uhh whats wrong"
"Little Timmy's clarinet isnt working."
"What happened?"
"He wanted to hear what the clarinet sounded like under water, so he took it in the pool-now it isnt working"
"I bet it isn't. You are going to have to take it in and have it fixed, and it is probably going to cost a lot of money."
"You never said that you cant put it in water, or in the pool."
She was right. I never told her that. Of course, I would think that it is obvious, and I certainly would not submerge something in water without knowing if it is submersible. I wouldn't think to tell someone not to put a microwave in the pool, but thats just me.
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Author: Dori
Date: 2010-09-14 16:08
Is that parent related to the guy who fell through a skylight while breaking into a building then sued because there was no warning the skylight wasn't safe to walk on?
There are smart people in the world. These are not examples of them.
I sympathize with the rant.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-14 16:11
I swear by this stuff: http://www.thomann.de/gb/stoelzel_fett.htm?sid=c1170a371ef31b2d6b704f719569fa04 I've used it since the '80s and have never had any trouble with it.
The thing is, no matter how much I explain the importance of maintaining any instrument to anyone for their own good once I've done any work on it, if they're not prepared to listen then I can't be held accountable for that.
I do tell everyone whose instruments I've worked on that if they encounter any problems no matter how small, bring it back to me as soon as possible so I can put it right there and then - and I can also check to see they're doing things right to avoid any more mishaps.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2010-09-14 16:15)
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2010-09-14 16:11
MarlboroughMan Wrote:
"What cork grease do you recommend?"
I'm a bit interested in this myself. I used to carry a small tin of cork grease in my case but for the last several years I have been using a Yamaha lipstick-type grease cartridge since it's so much more convenient. I've never had any problems with my corks deteriorating or sticking but I guess that doesn't mean there isn't something better than what I'm currently using.
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Author: Plonk
Date: 2010-09-14 16:11
NOT butter or even those lipstick ones.
What's wrong with the lipstick ones? I've always used a Vandoren brand lipstick style cork grease - seems ok to me?
Post Edited (2010-09-14 16:12)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-14 16:16
The lipstick grease is usually very thin and can soak through the cork making the glue fail. A heavy grease is best as that won't soak into the cork and you don't have to use much of it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2010-09-14 16:49
It doesn't really mean much if the cork grease comes in a lipstick tube or not, for example the Doctor grease comes in either lipstick or a small comntainer. This is the natural type. In years I've never had problems with this damaging natural cork or the glue that is holding it. I don't especially like Doctor synthetic grease because it's too.. greasy... IMO. For synthetic grease, I really like Alisyn. Actually Alisyn has the best texture I've tried, but Doctor comes in a nice lipstick tube which is more comfortable for players. I haven't tried the type Chris uses but heard from several it is good too. Vaselin type cork grease tends to cause problems.
Salzo, under water the clarinet sounds like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q2TK-gefio it is proof it is possible to play under water! 
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2010-09-14 16:57
Can you use DRAIN-O, the stuff used to unplug sinks??? hehe
Claribass - Thats one funny video. If that was a wood clarinet, such as an R13, too bad a shark wasn't near to save the horn.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2010-09-14 22:03
The Ferree's tool catalog has (or at least used to have) a picture of a completely submerged clarinet in its advertisement for Norbeck synthetic pads. As far as I'm concerned playing underwater is about all they're good for.
On a different note, how is one supposed to perform the "float" test without putting the clarinet in water?
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2010-09-15 06:36
Re the cork grease - I always put a small jar into the case, on the house, they're cheap enough. (and if there's no swab, I'll add one too)
--
Ben
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-26 12:20
It gets better - the owner just collected the clarinet (the 10S in the original message) and I mentioned how dusty it was and needed a good cleanup while it was all apart while having the tenon corks replaced, turns out he'd been using a soft brush with talc to clean the keys with after playing!
He said 'so I've been doing everything wrong?' - short answer, yes.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2010-09-26 12:26
...but it's easier to steer someone into the right direction if said person already has the inclination to care for the instrument.
On the other hand, it's difficult to teach someone who just throws the instrument into a corner when done with it for the day.
--
Ben
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Author: Franklin Liao
Date: 2010-09-26 12:31
Urr... regarding case.
1: Put the case on the ground and
2: be sure that the case is really going to fit the Clarinet in question.
I will illustrate with a true story. (It is one of those cool story, bro)
My Marigaux came in a case that was meant for an Albert system clarinet made in the early turn of the 20th century. It didn't fit, and well... interesting things result from this after I received it.
I sent the horn to Morrie for an overhaul, and upon getting it back, I stuffed it back into that case since I've no spare, and by nightime when I can finally play it, lo and behold! Lower joint didn't respond well. Went back to the workshop and had the bridge mechanism re-regulated. The tech looked at me with that "you did it" look.
Morrie recommended a BAM case, but I felt something's amiss with the whole situation so I took off without taking up the offer. It is only yesterday night that it came to light as to what happened.
A coworker of mine toppled over that case with the horn in it, and the bridge mechanism on both upper and lower joint got knocked out of regulation. Had it been a case with a snug fit, keywork would not take the blunt force of impact... I am lucky I guess that it's just the bridge in some sense.
Resolution to this? I had him cough up a case meant for a modern Boehm horn or ask him to pony up for that BAM case. He came up with a Yamaha clarinet case and the rest is history...
Post Edited (2010-09-26 12:38)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-26 12:55
I set the owner right on everything he'd been doing wrong and how to do things right from this point onwards. It was a tough lesson learnt, but one learnt nevertheless.
The case for this clarinet is the old '70s Selmer case - heavy duty plywood construction with black covering and gold binding/edging around the lid and base with red velvet lining, so perfectly adequate to house this clarinet and will definitely save it from any harm.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2010-09-26 14:29
Chris -
The gold binding/edging will definitely migrate to the interior and improve the instrument's tone. However, red velvet interferes with the process. You should replace it with blue, or at least make sure the gold is 22 carat or better.
Ken ![[rotate]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smiley25.gif) Shaw
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Author: GLHopkins
Date: 2010-09-26 15:22
Frank said, "A coworker of mine toppled over that case with the horn in it, and the bridge mechanism on both upper and lower joint got knocked out of regulation. Had it been a case with a snug fit, keywork would not take the blunt force of impact... I am lucky I guess that it's just the bridge in some sense."
No offense intended, but that's a little hard to believe.
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Author: 2cekce ★2017
Date: 2010-09-26 15:59
I was told lansinoh or lanolin cream was good to use. its not nearly as thin as the lipstick stuff and only requires a tiny dab that goes a long way. btw those lipstip things really dont work that well but then again they are very cheap alternative. whats your opinion on the lanolin cream.
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Author: Franklin Liao
Date: 2010-09-26 18:26
@GLHopkins: Guy fessed up though!
(feels eyes of suspicion upon me, again)
I admit that I've made the mistake in the past of trying to simply connect the two joints together before without pressing on the top joint to lift the bridge actually, going back on topic. That and leaving the horn on a music stand... paying for the error sorted me out good.
Fortunately, I've not commit something such as leaving the instrument assembled. Putting it back into the case while it's still wet however is another thing. Them ABS are just so resilient. Good old high school days...
@Ben: My little jar of grease is still not exhausted after 1 year of use. I still have the freebee lipstick grease that came with student horns lying around the house somewhere. Stopped using them when I got back into the hobby.
Post Edited (2010-09-26 18:53)
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Author: Bassie
Date: 2010-09-26 18:28
Hm, used the lipsticks for years. But I don't like the ones that smell of liniment. I mean, what's that about? Can't be right. The ones redolent of lanolin seem OK. I apply very sparingly every assembly, never had a problem.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2010-09-26 18:48
Then again, as we don't apply that stuff by the pound, it isn't really a question of price. A small jar of my favourite grease lasts a long time.
--
Ben
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Author: Zenia
Date: 2010-09-26 20:48
"I was told lansinoh or lanolin cream was good to use. its not nearly as thin as the lipstick stuff and only requires a tiny dab that goes a long way. btw those lipstip things really dont work that well but then again they are very cheap alternative. whats your opinion on the lanolin cream."
My tech advised the same. It only requires a tiny amount, much cleaner than cork grease with none of the gunky build-up. The problem I had was to find a generic form of pure lanolin but I did find lanisoh (brand name) at the drug store
in the section for nursing mothers. It comes in a container similar to a tube of sun screen and you simply dab a bit on the finger and rub into the cork.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2010-09-27 04:31
For years I've been using plumbers waterproof grease for the joint corks. A small tube last for years and the consistency seems about right. I've never had joint cork problems other than those caused by age. You can get it in any hardware store.
Tony F.
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Author: salzo
Date: 2010-09-27 15:45
If you like looking for greases that will work, check out a product called "bore butter"- it used for seasoning muzzleloading firearms. I have used it when I cant find one of the gazillion tubes, containers of cork grease that I have.
Dont know what is in it, but it has a good consistency, and it is made from "all natural" ingredients.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2010-09-27 16:28
Any heavy duty grease should be suitable provided it doesn't go rancid.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Old Geezer
Date: 2010-09-28 05:43
I used to know a guy who never used cork grease of any kind. He would just give the cork joint a lick around with his wet tongue...worked for him!
Once I ran out of cork grease at home and just used some mustache wax...worked for me a few times anyway.
Clarinet Redux
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