 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2007-09-27 19:15
Well, I've lurked the forum for a few days but info is sooooo mixed I guess I might as well register and make my own post :-) !
So, our daughter is beginning Jr. High band this year and the rent-to-own route is just crazy! I feel we need to get her a "good/great" unit off the bat so that so can hear the true pleasure of the instrument and her own efforts, not to spoil her but encourage her. One that will (hopefully) take her into high school and beyond. As we are in the process of buying a home cash is oh so very tight. She already knows that if she is good enough she can get a college scholarship with music....LOL. (funny cuz she stated the fact to us, not us to her :-) )
So, I have my eye on a V-40 7250, opinions/suggestions???
Thanks in advance!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-09-27 19:21
spfrosty wrote:
> So, I have my eye on a V-40 7250, opinions/suggestions???
Look no further.
Be sure to get a decent mouthpiece; this is at least as important as a good clarinet.
--
Ben
--
Ben
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2007-09-27 20:01
tictactux wrote:
> Look no further.
>
> Be sure to get a decent mouthpiece; this is at least as
> important as a good clarinet.
>
> --
> Ben
>
Thanks Ben! I've just seen very mixed opinions about this (as well as any other model/brand :-) ) so I was curious.
As far as m.p. , suggestions or will that depend on her? I've seen a lot about a 4c.
Also, I have heard that you can change the barrel and/or bell and get better results??
thanks again!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-09-27 20:21
Well, per the mouthpiece - the 4C is a "can't go wrong" mouthpiece. Just like some Japanese cars - dependable but not necessarily exciting.
A dear friend sent me a Fobes Debut, and that's what I'd suggest, closely followed by the Hite Premiere. Neither breaks the bank (typically below 30$) but both are excellent starter beaks. (I still use them both)
Personally, I don't really buy that barrel/bell thing for us humble hobbyists. A professional has different needs and the skills to tickle the last bit out of such equipment. If you're into exchanging "money" for "tone", find a good teacher for your daughter.
--
Ben
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2007-09-27 20:38
tictactux wrote:
> Well, per the mouthpiece - the 4C is a "can't go wrong"
> mouthpiece. Just like some Japanese cars - dependable but not
> necessarily exciting.
>
> A dear friend sent me a Fobes Debut, and that's what I'd
> suggest, closely followed by the Hite Premiere. Neither breaks
> the bank (typically below 30$) but both are excellent starter
> beaks. (I still use them both)
Thanks!
tictactux wrote:
>
> Personally, I don't really buy that barrel/bell thing for us
> humble hobbyists. A professional has different needs and the
> skills to tickle the last bit out of such equipment. If you're
> into exchanging "money" for "tone", find a good teacher for
> your daughter.
>
LMAO...ok. I was just wondering about that "theory" :-) !
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-09-27 20:46
> LMAO...ok. I was just wondering about that "theory" :-)
Just to set the record straight - there are some fine barrel, bell and mouthpiece makers, and I highly respect their art.
I just think that at an early stage, other investments might be more important. (your very first bike didn't have 21 gears either, did it?)
--
Ben
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: gwie
Date: 2007-09-27 20:48
I start off all my clarinet beginners with a Fobes Debut. It has worked so consistently well for such a great price I don't recommend anything else.
I also get them a decent ligature (Bonade usually, but Rovner for the more careless ones and teach them to place the reed properly...Ben Armato talked to every single person about it who visited his booth at ClarinetFest 2007..*reed placement* makes all the difference in the world!
And reeds make a big difference too. I've got a mix of kids using Vandoren and Legere. Anything besides those cheap ones...:P
G.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2007-09-27 22:17
tictactux wrote:
>Just to set the record straight - there are some fine barrel, bell and >mouthpiece makers, and I highly respect their art.
>I just think that at an early stage, other investments might be more >important. (your very first bike didn't have 21 gears either, did it?)
>
>--
>Ben
>
Ben, I wasnt attempting to offend you, just at first read I understood you to saying the practice of "mix-n-matching" was non-sense.
My first bike could have had 21 gears
Thanks again!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-09-27 22:30
Oh, no offense taken at all. I just meant to be a bit more precise about my stance re aftermarket equipment.
--
Ben
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: claritoot26
Date: 2007-09-27 22:31
Mix-n-match in terms of bells and barrels is definitely for the pros, or if one of your parts breaks or is defective in some way. A decent mouthpiece, reeds, clarinet, and teacher are all one needs at the beginning.
Later on, like college or so, when she gets a professional clarinet, it will likely have a very good bell and barrel if an excellent instrument is chosen. Bells and barrels can improve the intonation, tone, and response of an older fine instrument that has lost its "ring". Anyway, don't worry about these for awhile. They only make a difference at the more advanced stage of playing.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2007-09-27 23:20
So then, how much "ring" will this combo have:
Vito 7250 V-40
Fobes MP
Bonade LIG
Reeds (?) (what about those synthetics, good/bad/difference?)
I assume the # on reed is yet to be determined as it depends on the person?
How would that all fit together and sound?
Again, my purpose is to get her something that will allow her to hear her potential very clearly and sound great if she was to ever get a solo part.
Not having worry about MAKING the unit sound good. I hope that makes sense.
Post Edited (2007-09-27 23:41)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CEC
Date: 2007-09-28 00:53
That Vito - Fobes - Bonade set-up is excellent. Regarding reeds, probably best to get advice from Mr. Fobes. He welcomes questions and is a very nice fellow. Contact info is at his site:
http://www.clarkwfobes.com/
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: joeyscl
Date: 2007-09-28 01:09
hmm, how long has she playing for? I think if she's a Beginner, the only difference between a pro instrument and a decent beginner instrument is only going to be... one is made of wood and one is plastic.... and the PRICE $$ >,<
Money is often better invested in private lessons...
just what I think
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Katrina
Date: 2007-09-28 03:51
AFAIK the Fobes Debut mps work great with #3 reeds. Maybe get one or two 2.5s but straight outta the gate I think a 3 will be fine with the Fobes.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2009-02-11 14:34
Yes, an old post, but my own so I'll bump it!
Since it has been a while since my original post I wanted to give this an update. I myself dislike following a post on a forum to a similar problem I may have only to find there is no "current" info or updates to the outcome.
We did buy her the V40, came in great condition, pads & cork was good. Cleaned it up myself (dusting, oiling, disinfecting, ect but without taking apart). Along with it I got her the Debut mouthpiece and rovner light lig. We have found she likes the RICO Royal 2.5 reeds out of those that we have tried, including the Luries. A 3 is still too hard (as expected).
She held 1st chair for about the last 3/4 of her 5th grade (when we start in band here). Now in 6th and the lack of members to justify them having their own lesson session, they are practicing with 7th and 8th graders! She still has 3rd chair with, of course, 7th & 8th graders holding 1 & 2. She is in 1st clarinet row as well.
She is having difficulties getting the higher notes and key changing (I forget from which keys). We have found that by placing the reed slightly higher than the beak she get the notes better with better tone overall as well, that was a neat little trick!
Their solos are coming up and her piece has quite a key range to so we feel good about that! Also, I am most confident her teacher will nominate her for IMEA www.imea.org competition, !
So, all in all I am very happy with the purchase!
The funny thing is, her teacher has not heard of the V40 :? !
Now a couple of questions:
1) what is the difference between the rovner light & dark?
2) how much better is the B12 from the V40?
3) is a german cut or french cut reed that much different than the Royals?
Thanks to all of you who helped me with this decision!
EDIT: wanted to add that we picked this up off ebay for $106 SHIPPED!
Post Edited (2009-02-11 20:21)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2009-03-24 13:38
---UPDATE---
I am not bumping my own post, I merely posting an update with the outcome of the current setup.
My daughter had her 6th grade solo a couple of weeks ago and I finally got around to uploading it. Have a listen and see what you think, despite her nerve problems :/ . On a side note, I later learned that this same solo was given to an 8th grader, I'm not sure what that is saying for the 8th grader or our daughter . She was the only 6th grader assigned this scale range and 3min length. Enjoy and love to hear your feedback.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOHUBIrA-L0
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: D
Date: 2009-03-24 19:38
Goodness what an angry sounding piano part! I know she probably doesn't get a choice, but a handy trick can be to have several pieces in hand which she can play well without much practice so that if she is asked to play something she can suggest something she is happy with, rather that something that gets assigned - or better still, a duet with another wind player. Much more sympathetic to both students. The beauty of this is that she can then have something where she starts and the piano joins in, not the other way around.....gives her a bit more control of the performance.
A way of practicing coming in when the piano has started is the get some of those book and CD combinations which have the clarinet part present on one track, and then you join in on a track where it is just the backing. This is a different skill to coming in in the right place in band when the conductor is there to encourage you and the rest of the section is playing along as well. I have found loads of them in public libraries so it doesn't necessarily have to cost anything. Alternatively, that auction site which shall not be named might be a good source of cheap ones.
I'm pretty impressed with your daughter's playing actually. Well done her. Can't tell too much about the sound on my rubbish laptop speaker (yes that is singular) but her fingers were certainly jolly agile and she seem to know her way round the instrument.
I will make a suggestion (and I could be wrong because of the sound quality my end so take with a pinch of salt.) If she feels lots of back pressure, and as if it is an effort to get a sound out it often results in quite a stuffy sound. To free it up try imagining that the air (not a huge amount or the reed closes up) is going terribly quickly through the instrument and hitting something about a foot away from the bottom of the clarinet. Perhaps even light a candle and get her to try and make the flame wobble. You have to shove it out with the muscles at the bottom of your lungs, you can't use those in your throat or it makes you feel quite sick fairly quickly.
Anyway, glad she is getting on so well. You must be very proud of her. When are you going to take it up too?!........
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: spfrosty
Date: 2009-03-24 21:07
LMAO....I have actually wished I could play along or already know how to play (in an effort to help her understand what she is doing).
Thanks for the reply D.
Yes, that piano sounds, well, angry. And we thought that during the performances as well.
No, the students don't get to pick their part :/ (all the students would then pic the easiest they could find...lol) I think the teacher chooses the part that she feels is at their playing level. During a concert she is able to join in, but when it came to this solo and being singled out she kinda tightened up on that MP I think...lol.
I will attempt to tape this same song again at home and post it as well. Maybe that will help distinguish what the instrument sounds like (the best that it can anyway via the net).
Thanks again D and I look forward to more opinions here!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: sultan
Date: 2009-03-24 22:24
I think she's quite good for a sixth grader. Her fingers are moving quite nicely but she needs to work a bit on her tone.
Some suggestions for her:
1. Relax and just keep on playing. She should imagine that its just her and her clarinet and just play. If she makes a mistake, just keep on going like nothing happened and get back to it while practicing.
2. She needs to get comfortable with crossing the break into the clarion register smoothly. Some exercises that have helped me in the past include:
- Slurring and tonguing twelfth intervals (i.e. going from chalumeau [really] low E to clarion low b (middle of treble clef) B, Low F to medium C, Low G to clarion (medium) D and so on till Chaulmeau (Low) C to Clarion (High) G. It may seem tedious but doing it for about a minute a day can really help
- Jumping from Chalumeau Bb to the Clarion B right above it. First do just the finger motions, in quick succession (i.e. jumping back and forth ~3 times a second) as much as she feels she needs to get her fingers used to it. Its one of the hardest jumps and is very common in music too. Usually doing it for a few seconds is enough. Then she should play the jumps quickly, for a few seconds. Major embouchure adjustments should not be needed in the jump but good air support is needed to get good tone and range.
- Play scales; it sound really easy but its the details in them that make a difference. The plain and simple Concert Bb (C) scale will do just fine. I'm sure she can play it just fine but one can always do better no matter how good you are. Even in high school, I find that most clarinet players hesitate a little bit when crossing the break (i.e. chalumeau high A to clarion low B) in scales. If she is confident that she can do that perfectly, consistently, at a good pace, with good tone, then she can try extending the scale to two octaves (from low C to the clarion very high C).
Hope this of some help to your daughter.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
