 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ajc
Date: 2008-07-25 18:37
How would one go about making all state band on clarinet. I practice everyday on my scales making sure they're smooth and I just got the etudes off the Web. I'm doing the whole slow practice on the technical etudes and everything and am doing my best to create dynamic contrasts on all of them (fast and slow) too. What else can I do to ensure that I'll make it?
*edit: I do have all of my scales memorized. I didn't make Area last year, because as a freshman I didn't realize all of the work that had to be put into the music. But my band director says I have what it takes to make All- State (a nice warm tone, excellent articulation...). I have matured and learned a lot from my past failure of not making it though and I know know that I need to work my butt off. BTW I'm trying out for the Texas All-State Band and I am actually playing Rose etude no. 26 and Rose studies 20 and 34. Sorry I wasn't clear about that earlier... But thank you all for the advice you have given me. I am currently applying your wisdom to my practicing and how I will audition. Thanks again!
-ajc
Post Edited (2008-07-28 13:45)
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Author: GBK
Date: 2008-07-25 19:43
Lots of questions...
Have you already made All-County, All-Area, All-District or equivalent?
Can you play a solo of the highest level music (level 5, 6 or 7 - depending upon what state you live in) near perfectly with appropriate interpretation, musicality, proper technique and with a very pleasing tone.
Are all scales memorized?
Can you sight read rhythms in compound time signatures and play it near perfectly on first reading?
Do you have a private teacher to help you prepare your All State solo?
Even with all the above, making All State on clarinet (at least in NY) usually requires a 100 rating and a top proficiency ranking from your audition center.
BTW - On popular instruments like flute and clarinet, where scoring 100 on the solo audition happens frequently, entrance into All State is not always guaranteed...GBK
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Author: Tara
Date: 2008-07-25 20:58
A very well known percussion/drum corps arranger once said "There's no defense in competitive music. All you can do is go out there and play your butt off."
So there you go. Good luck!
Tara
Post Edited (2008-07-26 14:58)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2008-07-25 21:01
At the audition, follow directions. Do exactly what they tell you to do. Judges often test this. They'll tell you to start at the third measure, which has only one note followed by rests, and the solo begins in the fourth measure. If you don't play that one note, you lose.
Count like crazy, especially on long notes and rests. Inaccurate rhythm is the primary reason players lose auditions.
Play a little slower than your best speed. Slow and even beats fast and sloppy every time. If the judges want to hear it faster, they'll ask you.
Good luck. Let us know how you do.
Ken Shaw
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Author: mrn
Date: 2008-07-25 21:38
What state are you located in, ajc? It seems that NY (GBK's state) and TX (where I live and once-upon-a-time made all-state) have different audition procedures for all-state.
Not having heard you play and not knowing what etudes you will be playing, it's hard to tell you what to work on, but here are some general tips:
1.) On fast etudes, if you can play the notes and rhythms, the biggest hurdle is probably articulation. You have to get your fingers and tongue synchronized. My favorite practice technique to work on this is to vary the rhythms (turn 16th notes into dotted 16th-32nd pairs and practice this way, then reverse the rhythm and do 32nd-dotted 16th pairs).
2.) Practice fast etudes slowly and work up your speed. When you play for the judges, play them as fast as you can play them musically and cleanly, but no faster. This takes some musical judgment to do. You have to know which etudes were written specifically with speed in mind (Rose Etude #26, for example). Other "allegro" etudes may not sound musical when played at lightning speed. Pay attention to the tempo recommendations given by the all-state people. Some judges may decide to dock you points if you don't play within the recommended tempi (especially on the slow etudes, where they can actually dock you points for playing too slowly). On the other hand if you can play Rose Etude #26 perfectly while breaking the speed limit, you may actually earn points. Again, you have to use good judgment, which is something a good teacher can provide you with--you might also want to consult with a teacher or band director who has judged all-state in your area before to get some idea what the judges will be listening for.
3.) Every serious contender for all-state is going to play the dynamic contrasts written. If you want to be selected, you have to go one step further than that and make music out of it. That means understanding the phrasing and general feel of the music. This is where a teacher's advice is irreplaceable. It also doesn't hurt to hear a good recording of what you're going to play. If you're playing one or more of Rose's 32 etudes, I suggest you invest in a professional recording of them, such as Sean Osborn's recording of them, which is available on iTunes as well as on CD.
4.) Become familiar with alternative fingerings for altissimo notes and learn how to "voice" notes for negotiating the "upper break." There are a number of etudes I've seen that have tricky slurs across the "upper break" between the clarion and altissimo registers. You should ideally learn how to execute these kind of slurs without and squeaks, grunts or other "crud" between the notes, because if you can do that, it will set you apart from a most high-school level players! This basically involves learning how to adjust your oral cavity and embouchure pressure to accomodate the break. There are also certain alternate fingerings that make this easier. Tom Ridenour's clarinet fingering book (published by Leblanc) describes a lot of these. A good teacher can help with this.
5.) Make sure your instrument is in very good condition and free of leaks. You may have a minor leak or other problem that, while not generally noticeable to you, may make the instrument more difficult to play if you have to unconsciously compensate for it.
6.) Learn how to balance/adjust reeds. When I was a senior in high school, I took a lesson with the principal clarinet of the Houston Symphony (David Peck). He makes his own reeds. He let me try one. I was absolutely astounded at how much easier the instrument was to play (in basically every respect) when using a well-adjusted reed. Learning to adjust your own reeds will pay big dividends because a good reed makes everything easier.
7.) Take lessons from a good teacher. (This is the most important thing.)
8.) See 6.
9. ) See 7.
Now, none of these things will "ensure" that you make all-state, but they ought to help. Of course, there is a more surefire way to make all-state, and that is to do all of the above but audition on alto clarinet (or possibly bass or contra-alto clarinet), where there is much less competition--I've known folks who did that, and it definitely worked for them. There is always more than one way to do things...
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-07-25 22:09
work harder than all of the other clarinet students in your state.
can't be from texas - etudes haven't been posted yet - they will be tomorrow night or sunday.
*edit - i stand corrected. texas state etudes were just released. tmea.org
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
Post Edited (2008-07-25 22:14)
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Author: Claire Annette
Date: 2008-07-25 23:10
When I was in high school (and did well in my All-County/State/Honors Band auditions), I learned to do the following to help remain calm and focused:
1. I didn't waste my time chatting with the other people auditioning. I simply focused on my main objective...doing my best.
2. I refused to concentrate on the others' warm-ups. Generally, the clarinetists in the halls were basically showing off for one another instead of genuinely warming up. You know the bit: playing scales as loud, as fast, and as high as they could. To this day, I can't stand that kind of posturing.
3. I'd find a lone area or even a restroom to warm up in. No curious eyes or ears to give me unsolicited advice or criticism.
4. In my audition, if I did make a mistake, I kept on going as if nothing had happened. I thanked the judge(s) after finishing the audition.
5. I didn't go out and "share" about my audition. I was competitive! (Still am.) My motto was, "Why give away information about what happened in the audition or about the key and tempo of the sightread piece? Let them find out for themselves like I had to!"
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Author: CEC
Date: 2008-07-25 23:48
Find out what you need to accomplish to qualify for an audition. In Virginia, you need to be in the top six seats of your regional band.
Find out what the requirements are for your state audition. They're probably on the web somewhere. Here's Virginia's, for example:
http://www.vboda.org/AllVa/Auditions/wind_perc_require.htm
Work hard and study privately, if possible.
Oh yeah, and what everybody else said above.
Sincerely,
12th chair, 1984 Virginia All-State Band
Post Edited (2008-07-25 23:52)
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Author: mrn
Date: 2008-07-26 02:17
pewd wrote:
> *edit - i stand corrected. texas state etudes were just released. tmea.org
Hi Paul! I didn't realize they had been released, either. (since I don't teach, I don't keep up with these things) After I read your post, though, I thought I'd buzz by tmea.org and see what the selections were this year, just for fun. It's a funny coincidence that they picked my favorite speedy etude (Rose #26) this year.
It looks like the TMEA audition format is pretty much the same as it was when I was in school with three Rose etudes/studies. At the high school level, they didn't make us play scales, though, and I don't know if they do now. (Or maybe that's a area-by-area or region-by-region requirement...I have no idea.)
It looks like the NY format is perhaps a little bit more like our solo/ensemble contests where you play one piece and get a numerical score (and, I assume, a critique sheet or scoring sheet as well).
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-07-26 02:29
they came out sometime between this morning and when i hit the enter key on my post above. i recorded a few lines of each and put them on a web page for my students, hopefully that will motivate them to practice this weekend.
scales: varies by region ; most regions do NOT require scales, as the auditions go too long. a few of them do require scales. thats up to each region.
i don't think the process has changed in , oh, since dinos roamed the earth...
fish play 1/2 of 2 of the etudes. they have a region band , but thats it. i'm not sure if all of regions have a fish band, i don't think so.
9-12, they play all 3 of the etudes. top 6 or 9 (depending on school size) pass on to area. top area students make state. I'm real tired of hearing those etudes by february when the kids go off to the state concert.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: Ryder
Date: 2008-07-26 04:53
pewd,
indeed not all regions have "fish" bands. As for the audition times, here in region 11 they last about 4-5 hours the first day and 3-4 the second day. WOW is it ever boring in those rooms.
Area auditions are so much better. Everyone know the music at least fairly well, and there are fewer of them!
Start early, like as soon as the music is released, and begin very slowly. Waiting until a month before auditions to start taking the music seriously is a huge mistake. You'll always be several steps behind. try to obtain recordings. I know in texas. Texas Tech puts out recordings for each instrument. David Shea does a good job. Use a metronome religiously every day. even tempo is a must, especially in slow etudes.
Above all, plan well. Try to have the etudes technically flawless, or as close to as humanly possible, about two to three weeks in advance of the auditions. If you move to the next round such as area in texas, never take a break from the music, keep pushing because generally, you can always do better. Slow things down ever so slightly in the audition. A judge wants to hear it clean and slower, rather than fast and messy.
____________________
Ryder Naymik
San Antonio, Texas
"We pracice the way we want to perform, that way when we perform it's just like we practiced"
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-07-26 14:36
>as close to as humanly possible
if you don't , someone else will.
things judges take off for big time -
rhythm errors. wrong notes.
the difference in the kids that make it is nuances - phrasing, style, tone, articulations. before you can work on musicality, the rhythm and notes have to be perfect. you should have the state music almost memorizied if you are serious about getting in. regardless of where you live.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-07-26 14:45
I taught the 1st chair alto sax of Pennsylvania all state band this past year, and can say that there is both skill and prepared luck involved.
Really accurate technique and a great sound are a start, but it is also highly a numbers game too.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2008-07-26 16:38
pewd wrote:
> before you can work on musicality, the rhythm and notes have to be perfect.
I find that to be very poor advice in any musical context. Musicality should be something you work on from day one, and should be integrated with work on all other aspects of any piece of music. Otherwise, and I've heard it over and over, people won't work on musicality until everything technical is at 100%... however, many people may only be at 95% come audition or performance, or only reach their definition of 100% a couple days before.
Then you end up with someone who is trying to squeeze in musicality at the last moment. It sounds forced, or it is not there at all. You've lived with the piece so long in a purely technical manner that the musicality doesn't come natural. Further, for me I've found that having a musical perspective on something (combined with solid technical chops) is a very effective way to not freak out at a performance, because it gives a reason to be there other than "I'm going to play these notes PERFECTLY."
Regardless, early practice will likely be heavily focused on getting the piece under your fingers accurately, and that's fine. It should, however, be accompanied by developing musical perspective on the piece, even if, early on, it isn't done with the clarinet in hand, but rather just humming the piece to yourself and exploring what can be done with it. Ideally, this should happen BEFORE you've even tried to play a single note of it.
Putting musicality off for any reason whatsoever is, IMHO, the quickest route to a run of the mill, uninspired performance. In an audition or in a recital, that's the last thing you want.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: chumbucket804
Date: 2008-07-26 16:44
I suggest playing for everyone you can. Play for family, friends, teachers, neighbors, pets... anyone who will listen to you. Not only can they give you advice, but it will help with nerves (if that's a problem for you).
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-07-26 16:49
You have to walk before you can run ....
Get the fingers down before the musiciality or the musicality won't mean much....
A beautiful phrase delivered sloopily is not good.
And of course fingers without musicality are meaningless too.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
Post Edited (2008-07-26 17:50)
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Author: mrn
Date: 2008-07-27 02:00
EEBaum wrote:
>pewd wrote:
>> before you can work on musicality, the rhythm and notes have to be
> perfect.
> I find that to be very poor advice in any musical context. Musicality should
> be something you work on from day one, and should be integrated with
> work on all other aspects of any piece of music.
I don't think Paul intended his suggestion to be taken that literally--at least that's not how I read it. Otherwise, I don't think he'd be making recordings for his students to listen to.
I think the point Paul and David are making (or, if not, I'll make it myself) is that it is really hard to *sound* musical until you have the technique down. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be *thinking* about musicality from the outset, so that you have in mind what you should sound like.
That's why I think Paul's approach of making recordings of the etudes for his students to listen to early on in the process is a really good idea. That way, when his students get everything under their fingers, they already have a good idea what the music should sound like. The Suzuki violin folks do basically the same thing. The idea is that learning music is like learning a language. Before you can speak it fluently with a good accent, you need a lot of exposure to native speakers.
Post Edited (2008-07-27 02:01)
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-07-27 06:10
>A judge wants to hear it clean and slower, rather than fast and messy.
you bet.
far too many of them never get the technical aspects down. they miss many notes at the audition. most high school students don't comprehend the level they need to take it to. there is no excuse for wrong notes after studying the piece for 4 months.
many students in this state are required to show up at the regional auditions by their band directors, regardless of their ability level. the regional level is the filtering level, to weed out the kids that can not play the instrument. some of them can't even hit all the higher notes in the etudes, much less tell you their names or fingerings. some of them can't even get past the first measure without missing notes. so - first and foremost - learn all the notes and rhythms. perfectly. if you can not do that, you won't get past the region level, much less state.
my message for the students is that it has to be at such a high level that missing a note doesn't even come into play - you have to know the pieces that well. go do that then come see me to talk about the other stuff - but 90% of them never get that far.
and i note we still don't know what state the OP resides in; nor their ability level.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: Ryder
Date: 2008-07-27 06:22
A studeny may play both their technical etudes and not do such a great job, but if they play their slow etude with amazing musicality, phrasing, and style, they can excell beyond those who are more technically perfect than they are. Musicality, phrasing and style show maturity in the player.
I am not saying that you can slack on your technical etudes as long as your slow etude is perfect...not at all!! That is no way to go about making state. Remember that you are not required to make state, so you must be responsible enough to practice early and set goals.
Paul,
It is very frustrating to see all of the people who are auditioning at the region level only because their band director required them to. especially when you consider that only about 20% of the people who show up are going to make it. Even then a large percentage of them don't deserve to be there.
____________________
Ryder Naymik
San Antonio, Texas
"We pracice the way we want to perform, that way when we perform it's just like we practiced"
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Author: mrn
Date: 2008-07-27 16:44
That's interesting that so many directors *make* their students go to region tryouts--I can believe it, though, given the competitiveness of band programs here in Texas (second only to football and arguably more competitive than football in some places---I can probably only get away with saying that here in front a bunch of musicians, though! :-) ).
We actually had sort of the opposite problem at my high school. I'm not sure if it was because of TMEA rules or budgetary constraints, but they could only send a limited number of us to region tryouts every year. So at one point our directors instituted a policy where everyone who wanted to go to region had to essentially "play off" each piece for the directors in order for them to let us go. Although we were kind of an unusual case (by my senior year almost a third of our top band's clarinet section had made all-state, and we made 5A honor band that year), it sounds like more schools ought to have a policy like we had. If nothing else, it would make region tryouts much less tiresome for the competitors.
Post Edited (2008-07-28 04:35)
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-07-27 16:51
Local school district actually measures the success of their Bacd director based on the number of students who make district band.
Not the chairs, but the sheer number. So if he had 8 students make it and all get low chairs, that would be higher ranked than 4 section principals.
True and really dumb...
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-07-27 17:44
>because their band director required them to.
hot button, don't get me started...
don't get me wrong- i teach style, expression, phrasing, etc. , depending on the student's ability level.
one student yesterday sight read all 3 etudes, i stopped her and commented that she was reading the notes and rhythms, but not the dynamics or phrasing. response from the student, yeah, oops, sorry, i wasn't paying close enough attention.
the next student still has trouble comprehending that a whole note gets 4 beats, and she literally doesn't recognize what a 16th note is. anything above a top of the staff G, she does not know the note name, much less the fingering.
yet both are required to audition.
so you have to put it context. not knowing the OP's location or ability level, we've pretty much said it all on this topic.
to the OP, there is much wisdom in the posts above - work harder than all the other students in your state if you wish to succeed - good luck. if you happen to be in texas - you best be able to play these pieces by memory, or close to it.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: RLSchwebel
Date: 2008-07-27 19:35
I've done a lot of judging in South Texas...Corpus Chrisit and Rio Grande Valley...District, Region, and Area. Frankly, few can play all the rhythm, notes and artictulations at once. Hell if I can get any dynamic contrast, much less any musicality from a contestant...rather or not I agree with the interpretation, they are first chair by default.
A wrong note, rhythm, or artictualtion are inexcusable, but my fellow judges are oblivious, maybe tone death and seems to ignore the errors. I put my money on it that it all goes wrong when sax players judge clarinet players, lol. Because God knows, the worst the sound the clarinet player has the higher those judges have them on the contest sheet...so sad...
Sadly, I'd settle for correct key signatures, rhythms, articuations, and any dynamic change....oh, if there was a rit., I'd faint...
Happy Judging...I'd recommend a Valium to get you through the day....
~robt
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Author: autumnsilence
Date: 2008-07-28 07:23
i have attempted or set goals to try out, and it is easy in alaska, you just record a tape and send it, althoguht the audition material is always MUCh harder than anything you will play in the band.. to weed out people of course. And i think it is great practice that for our band, the new band director decided to have us play a piece from the all-state audition material as 'tryouts' for the everyday chairplacement. it really shows who is passionate about music and who is just in band for an extra credit..the first chair girl beat me my one point!! ahh! ...anyway, practiceis definiately key, ad dont procrastinate, it will come back to bie you in the ass, trust me
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