 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: tedm
Date: 2006-10-20 23:18
I have a question on reeds. My daughter is learning clarinet, and I am going to try as well. She is taking lessons, and has school band, and I'm learning from her and books.
When she started, the band teacher told her to get #2 rico's, then after her first couple of sessions, her band teacher told her to get 1.5's. Then she started private lessons, and her teacher told her she needed 2.5's.
So since she is OK with 2.5's we're good for now.
So I'm wondering, what do I start with? I can blow the first few notes, with occasionall squealling on a #2 reed, but haven't tried 1.5 or 2.5 yet. We're going to the store to get my daughter 3 # 2.5's, and I'm wondering if I should try something different? We each have our own mouthpieces, the clarinet is an Artley 17S.
The trouble I'm having is when not playing right, I am playing octave up sounds or "squealling" as my daughter says, "breaking it" as someone else says. So even though I have the pressure OK, I think I can use the "beginner" reed #, whatever # that is. Thanks.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-10-20 23:31
She should really start on 1.5 strength reeds if she's a beginner - starting on a 2.5 won't do any good for her embouchure at all as she does need to develop her embouchure and sound gradually, and a hard reed from the outset isn't going to do this - she will tire quickly and find pplayig a struggle, and if it seems like a struggle to her that could cause her to lose interest.
It's like weight training - start on light weights that can be lifted easily and repeatedly without straining anything instead of trying to lift a heavy weight and risk doing yourself damage.
And practice breathing into the clarinet to make a sound, not blowing.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: tedm
Date: 2006-10-20 23:39
Thanks, this is the opinion of the band teacher, so I'll ask the private teacher what his thinking is for the 2.5. Very interesting. Thanks.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2006-10-21 00:22
"Whatever rocks your boat" would be my suggestion. Go to a music store that sells single reeds (most here do). Get one or two of each 1.5 up to 3, maybe two different brands. Work your way up, starting with the softest.
In the first weeks I had enough to do with tired muscles and saliva and couldn't be bothered with "1.5 is too soft" and all that. After roughly two weeks I moved up to a #2 and meanwhile (after a year) I'm comfortable at 3.0 or 3.5, depending on how fit I feel.
What counts more (in my limited but at least fresh experience) than getting chops like a pit bull in no time is to find the sweet spot in whatever reed you're using (you'll feel and hear it when you've found it). The muscles will build up automatically.
--
Ben
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Author: D
Date: 2006-10-21 21:53
It will partly depend on which mouthpiece you/she is/are using and how big the tip opening is. I play different strengths on different mouthpieces myself. If you look on the Vandoren web site (as an example) this has a chart where different reed strengths are recommended for different mouthpieces. You will see the general correlation between opening and strength.
It may be that your daughter is able to sustain a consistant pressure which is high enough that the 1.5 is closing up on her mouthpiece (likely if the mouthpiece is quite closed at the tip) and stopping the sound altogether. The private teacher, hearing her one on one, would hear this where the band teacher would not. On the other hand the private teacher might be nuts.
If she is leaving indentations of teeth in her lower lip (or the mouthpiece) then she is biting and her lips aren't doing the job they should be. If this is what is takes to get a sound out of the 2.5 then something is wrong. If there is no evidence of biting, she is making a decent sound and seems comfortable then maybe she has found the correct strength for her at the moment.
Don't forget that your mouth will be a different shape to hers and the strength of your body will also be different, so even if you did have the same mouthpiece the reed you need is not necessarily going to be the same.
Good luck and have fun playing together.
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Author: donald
Date: 2006-10-22 11:37
you know what, i've started HUNDREDS of beginner players on size 2 reeds and have never once experienced any problems connected with the reed being too hard (and a lot of these students were very young/small kids). A far more common cause of problems has been the reed being too soft- apart from the problem of overblowing (and accidentally discovering the higher partials) good support of the air is difficult to develop if there's nothing to "push against". That being said, my own development (as a young student) was definately not helped by my premature advancement onto 3 and 3.5 reeds...
donald
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Author: Ed
Date: 2006-10-22 12:17
I always start beginners on #2. In my experience, the 1.5 is generally too soft for embouchure development. It doesn't require any real muscle support. I want the player to start to develop the proper embouchure and support right from the start. I have never had any problems with this set up.
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Author: tedm
Date: 2006-10-22 14:01
thanks all, Monday I will talk with the teacher, I did a single blind test with my daughter not knowing if a Rico 2 or 21/2 was in (we have 2 mouthpieces, so that's another variable that I didn't exclude). She didn't have any preference or feel either was easier or harder, but we both acknowledged she squeaked less with the 2 than 2 1/2.
I'm not going to get overly concerned as she is progressing well, faster than I am. Here's a clip of us playing together, first she is playing then I am playing (trying) to play the same notes on the guitar. I play guitar, but don't read music on the guitar well.
http://www.tedm.com/mp3s/clarinet3.mp3
also, thanks to those of you who emailed advice. It is extremely useful.
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Author: hans
Date: 2006-10-22 18:28
tedm,
It sounded to me like the clarinet was not being tongued? If that's the case, it's important to learn to do this early on.
Hans
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Author: GBK
Date: 2006-10-22 18:46
Hans is correct. It sounds as if the notes are not being tongued with the front part/tip of the tongue contacting the reed.
Rather, I hear a "huhh" or "fuhhh" sound which starts each note.
The school music teacher should have picked this up and introduced tonguing in the early weeks of instruction...GBK
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Author: tedm
Date: 2006-10-23 02:11
thanks for the info on tongue, I will bring this up with the teacher as well.
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