 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Garfield
Date: 2000-05-18 16:17
I am using a Vandoren B45 with size 3.5 and 4 reeds. Whenever my reeds become soft after awhile, my tone starts to turn shrill and thin. When I use size 3 reeds, my tone is also shrill.How am I able to play with soft reeds and still obtain a nice full sound?
Playing with size 4 reeds produce quite a decent full sound, however, it takes more effort and air support to use it. Playing softly would even be more tiring.Thats why I am looking towards using soft reeds.How am I able to play freely with a soft reed without compromising on the tone?My high notes on soft reeds sound thin.Do you actually change your embrochure when using different reed strength? It seems that I have to loosen my embrochure when playing with soft reeds, otherwise I would sound really thin.
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Author: steve
Date: 2000-05-18 18:17
what you are referring to is called "set-up"...
the concepts that enter into set up are:
it involves the reed "hardness", which is partially a function of reed butt thickness, reed heart shape and thickness, reed tip dimension and thickness, and these factors interact with mouthpiece facing dimensions, mouthpiece bore shape and dimensions, barrell bore shape and dimensions, clarinet bore shape and dimensions, tone-hole undercutting, player's mouth, lips, and tongue characteristics, and a whole slew of things that are unique to you to produce a "feel" or sensation, when you blow to produce what is your concept of ideal tone in your head.......
this "feel" has the characteristics of "resistance"...how hard you have to blow and to produce a certain sound amplitude and how much the clarinet seems to be resisting your air input, embrochure tension, or how much embrochure muscle "support" you have to give your north-pole end of the clarinet to get it to speak, the factor that I call hang on...a hard concept to describe, but when you do a dimenuendo, how difficult is it to control it down to nothing...will you be able to control the dimenuendo and maintain the tone colors (I think ridenour calls this hold)...these concepts blend into the idea of responsiveness...how facile is the response to your physical input to allow subtle shading in dynamics and tone color (listen to someone play the solo to the third section of resphigi Il Pini di Roma to hear what I mean...how hard do you have to work to get this???)....
and this feel feeds back to your body, mind, and heart, and directs you how to produce your tone.
all of these concepts underly the question "how do I produce a nice tone on soft reeds?"
the answer is, you try to optimize all aspects of your set-up to allow the most comfortable, responsive feel for you...this allows you to make your tone...it may be with a strength 2 reed on mp x or strength 5 reed on mp y, or strength 4 reed with mpy and barell m.....or junk it all and use another combination on clarinet s...
I think the true answer to this is it must feel good to you...a very wise teacher told me "life is too short for a hard reed", and another one told me "an embrochure is like a soft gentle pillow for your friend, the reed and mp", a third one demanded I use a high resistance set-up with the old moree 2.5 logs....
this discussion can go on forever....you have to experiment...
s.
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Reply To Message
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Author: steve
Date: 2000-05-18 18:17
what you are referring to is called "set-up"...
the concepts that enter into set up are:
it involves the reed "hardness", which is partially a function of reed butt thickness, reed heart shape and thickness, reed tip dimension and thickness, and these factors interact with mouthpiece facing dimensions, mouthpiece bore shape and dimensions, barrell bore shape and dimensions, clarinet bore shape and dimensions, tone-hole undercutting, player's mouth, lips, and tongue characteristics, and a whole slew of things that are unique to you to produce a "feel" or sensation, when you blow to produce what is your concept of ideal tone in your head.......
this "feel" has the characteristics of "resistance"...how hard you have to blow and to produce a certain sound amplitude and how much the clarinet seems to be resisting your air input, embrochure tension, or how much embrochure muscle "support" you have to give your north-pole end of the clarinet to get it to speak, the factor that I call hang on...a hard concept to describe, but when you do a dimenuendo, how difficult is it to control it down to nothing...will you be able to control the dimenuendo and maintain the tone colors (I think ridenour calls this hold)...these concepts blend into the idea of responsiveness...how facile is the response to your physical input to allow subtle shading in dynamics and tone color (listen to someone play the solo to the third section of resphigi Il Pini di Roma to hear what I mean...how hard do you have to work to get this???)....
and this feel feeds back to your body, mind, and heart, and directs you how to produce your tone.
all of these concepts underly the question "how do I produce a nice tone on soft reeds?"
the answer is, you try to optimize all aspects of your set-up to allow the most comfortable, responsive feel for you...this allows you to make your tone...it may be with a strength 2 reed on mp x or strength 5 reed on mp y, or strength 4 reed with mpy and barell m.....or junk it all and use another combination on clarinet s...
I think the true answer to this is it must feel good to you...a very wise teacher told me "life is too short for a hard reed", and another one told me "an embrochure is like a soft gentle pillow for your friend, the reed and mp", a third one demanded I use a high resistance set-up with the old moree 2.5 logs....
this discussion can go on forever....you have to experiment...
s.
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Reply To Message
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Author: steve
Date: 2000-05-18 18:17
what you are referring to is called "set-up"...
the concepts that enter into set up are:
it involves the reed "hardness", which is partially a function of reed butt thickness, reed heart shape and thickness, reed tip dimension and thickness, and these factors interact with mouthpiece facing dimensions, mouthpiece bore shape and dimensions, barrell bore shape and dimensions, clarinet bore shape and dimensions, tone-hole undercutting, player's mouth, lips, and tongue characteristics, and a whole slew of things that are unique to you to produce a "feel" or sensation, when you blow to produce what is your concept of ideal tone in your head.......
this "feel" has the characteristics of "resistance"...how hard you have to blow and to produce a certain sound amplitude and how much the clarinet seems to be resisting your air input, embrochure tension, or how much embrochure muscle "support" you have to give your north-pole end of the clarinet to get it to speak, the factor that I call hang on...a hard concept to describe, but when you do a dimenuendo, how difficult is it to control it down to nothing...will you be able to control the dimenuendo and maintain the tone colors (I think ridenour calls this hold)...these concepts blend into the idea of responsiveness...how facile is the response to your physical input to allow subtle shading in dynamics and tone color (listen to someone play the solo to the third section of resphigi Il Pini di Roma to hear what I mean...how hard do you have to work to get this???)....
and this feel feeds back to your body, mind, and heart, and directs you how to produce your tone.
all of these concepts underly the question "how do I produce a nice tone on soft reeds?"
the answer is, you try to optimize all aspects of your set-up to allow the most comfortable, responsive feel for you...this allows you to make your tone...it may be with a strength 2 reed on mp x or strength 5 reed on mp y, or strength 4 reed with mpy and barell m.....or junk it all and use another combination on clarinet s...
I think the true answer to this is it must feel good to you...a very wise teacher told me "life is too short for a hard reed", and another one told me "an embrochure is like a soft gentle pillow for your friend, the reed and mp", a third one demanded I use a high resistance set-up with the old moree 2.5 logs....
this discussion can go on forever....you have to experiment...
s.
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Author: steve
Date: 2000-05-18 18:17
sorry for multiple posts
s.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2000-05-19 03:48
B40 is a specially designed mouthpiece for soft reeds player such as French people(Originally designed by a French clarinetist Guy Deprus- my spelling may be wrong.) 2-1/2 or 3 Vandoren traditional are suitable. I once used B40 with 3 Vnadoren hand selected. It was compact and has good projection, but not dark, I felt. See Vandoren's own table and description.
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Author: Bino
Date: 2000-05-19 07:18
Maybe you should try putting the tip of the reed higher up on the mouthpiece and also move your ligature as high up on the reed as you can...This will allow you to enjoy playing on a soft reed and maybe, just maybe help your tone a little...Hope it works...
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Author: William
Date: 2000-05-20 14:58
My old teacher thinks most clarinetists use reeds that are too hard. Most often, a hard reed that sounds rich and dark to you on your mp will sound dull and lifeless to the audience. Reeds that may sound a bit shrill, however, will often sound vibrant and full to your listeners. I suggest you record your sound using different reeds and then decide the strength vs quality issue. Your shrill sound may be just fine after-all. Also, a double-lip embrocure helps.
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Author: beejay
Date: 2000-05-21 09:40
May I suggest trying the Vandoren B45-lyre mouthpiece. I switched from a B45 with a Rovner ligature and VD No.3 reeds to a B45 lyre with a Spriggs Ligature and Glotin 2.5 reeds and am happy with the result. Not powerful but very sweet.
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