 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: bflatclarinetist
Date: 2005-04-08 02:46
For me to break into my vandoren traditional 2.5s to takes me about a week or maybe more. And this is really fustrating when tests are coming up and they sound terribly stuffy and squeaky, sluggish and yeah. But when I tried a Rico 2.5 it was just amazing, the first time I've used it and I just broke into it like that...
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-04-08 02:56
The Rico felt great as they are "easy to play".
I wouldn't use a regular Rico reed for anybody as they to me are "chainsaw reeds".
Rico does make much higher quality reeds in terms of the cut and cane selection - I would suggest that you try them and they will also play very, very easily, be highly consistant and give you a much better sound than the regular Rico do. Rico regular #2 1/2 would be like almost a Vandoren 1 1/2 ( 1 3/4 really but they don't make them) as they are much, much softer. That difference is probably what you are feeling.
My favorite reed (and yes, I do endorse them) is the Rico Grand Concert Thick blank and their Evolution reed. You can probably get 10 out of 10 to play well - 8 for a really bad box.
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Author: bflatclarinetist
Date: 2005-04-08 03:18
I'm an intermediate student, so I wouldn't want to try something like a 4 yet. Are the evolution reeds thick?
Or even better question, how can I learn to play on thicker reeds? Does strengthening your embouchure have anything to do with this?
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-04-08 03:39
Honestly, if you like the sound of the vandorens, I'd stick with them and just MAKE SURE to PLAN at least a week ahead of any testing for a break-in period. What I'm trying to do is to buy and break in one box a month. And when that box gets broken in, I dump the old reeds, whether they were still useable or not. That way I don't get stuck with any real "duds" and not enough well broken in ones to compensate.
Yeah it's 20 dollars a month, but that's a small price to pay IMO for the knowledge of ALWAYS having a broken in, and not overplayed reed in your case.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
Post Edited (2005-04-08 05:27)
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-04-08 04:27
Step up the reeds over time. Go up a half step and wait until you're very comfortable.
I currently have a dozen opened boxes of reeds, from which I break in four to six at a time. I break them in over a ten-day period, and play each reed an average of twice per week after that. I break in at most 40 reeds a year. At any given time, I have probably 6 concert-ready reeds (about two REALLY good ones), 6 practice and far-from-concert-rehearsal reeds, and 6 junkers for abusive woodshedding that are retired as I break in new ones.
If you have a system and don't kill good reeds by overplaying them, they can last very long. I use a variation of the Larry Guy book's process. There are numerous threads mentioning a bunch of good books to use as reference.
In short, if you break them in faster, they will likely die faster. Instead, make sure you always have multiple good reeds, and don't kill them.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2005-04-08 05:56
It's possible that not only are you using reeds that are too hard, but the Rico was just right for you.
No reed should sound stuffy and be too hard when you first play it. Maybe it should be slightly stuff, but not completely stuffy. Breaking in a reed doesn't mean getting it to a comfortable strength - it means getting it to the point where it has the characeristics you like best.
Try a weaker strength of the Vandoren and see how you go. Oh and bear in mind that Vandoren seem to package all kinds of strengths into a box!
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-08 06:10
External factors which you have little control over (temperature, humidity, etc...) have a great deal to do with reed performance.
Thus, keep a number of reeds (minimum 4) in a performance ready state. To cover all contingencies it is also wise to have some of these reeds prepared slightly softer and some slightly harder than usual.
I tell my students to use a rotation based on the "Rule of 12" -
- Have 4 newer reeds which are in the process of being broken in and adjusted.
- Have 4 fully prepared reeds which are performance ready.
- Have 4 older reeds which are for practice sessions.
- As the newer reeds reach performance level, move them into the 2nd group. Then begin to break in a new batch (4) of reeds.
- As the performance reeds pass their prime, move them into the practice group.
- As the practice reeds wear out or become too difficult to play, toss them out.
Professionals often double, or triple the above numbers....GBK
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Author: RosewoodClarinet
Date: 2005-04-08 06:41
Yes, rotation helps to save good reeds for the concerts and auditions. Most of the time, for daily practice, I use reeds which are after their best condition and are old. Also, in general, these are weaker than they used to be.
I wait until good reeds become well-broken-in. It takes at least 2 weeks upto a month. I do not know how long exactly it takes. However, at certain point, I find that a reed is broken-in by hearing the vibration, responce, dynamics range, and overall sound.
I play reeds, take recordings (and listen to it), and try them at different places to hear the difference.....finally, I find good ones. Then, I use these good reeds for concerts and auditions. This is the moment that I feel the true pleasure on my clarinet playing.....even thought I find only few good reeds from such a huge amount of reeds......aaaagh!!
Good luck on reed, everyone.
RosewoodClarinet
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2005-04-08 12:04
Hi,
I also use GBK's Rule of 12 plus a couple more. My top 4 are performance ready, there are the practice reeds, and then the rest "in development." I use only the 4-place La Voz aluminum Reedguards for storage (hard to find but very nice).
However, among the brands that I currently have in the rotation are VD blue box, La Voz MH, Rico Royal 3 and 3 1/2, and (shudder) a couple odds and ends that play well (Rico brown box, Lurie, and some no-names). I'm pretty much a believer that - if I may paraphrase the Duke - "if it plays good, it is good." I use the ATG Reed System a lot.
As far as a reed being a "chairsaw reed" I have played Rico brown box reeds on sax, off and on, for over 50 years and sometimes, they are the very best. I also regularly play Selmer and Leblanc clarinets; yikes, what's wrong with me.
HRL
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-08 12:53
Hank:
Yes... The beauty and simplicity of the "Rule of 12" for students is that they can store and keep track of all their reeds in 3 inexpensive, 4-place reed holders ...GBK
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Author: bflatclarinetist
Date: 2005-04-08 20:59
okay, thanks for the input. I might try a vandoren 2, I think I'll only use ricos for when I don't have enough time to break into reeds cause they're ready-playable. Well I don't have enough reeds to have a rotation I only have 5 left in the box. And I throw away over-used reeds/reeds that have been used more than 3 months. Because they start sounding bad.
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Author: bflatclarinetist
Date: 2005-04-09 00:24
I just started to make a new rotation system =). I'm rotating 4 reeds. So today I broke all 4 of them and out of the four I have found one that works exceptionally good, so I'm mainly using that one and still in the process of breaking the other 3.
As for the rico, I'll save that for jazz because it sounds better in jazz. In classical it's way too loud, but in classical the vandoren brings a nice sweet sound =)
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Author: Neil
Date: 2005-04-09 02:19
What exactly happens to a reed to break it in and what causes it? Is it chemicals in the saliva or mechical vibration or a combination of the two, anybody know? Could I break in a reed by holding it in my mouth, or by taping it to a speaker?
By the way, my experience with Rico reeds is that the Rico Royals play great out of the box but don't last long; the Grand Concert Selects need the standard break-in but last for quite a while.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2005-04-09 03:05
Try this......Out of the box try reeds dry. try four and pick the best. Play it. When you are finished with it let it dry out for 5 minutes. Then put the reed in a reed case....don't let it dry out too much. You can use a ziplock bag or the Rico bag for moisture retention. When you take the reed out next time....it should play very similar to the first time....if it is wavy at the tip then it has dried out too much. I don't experience this break in period that you are noting. Oversoaking a new reed will make it stuffy and difficult to evaluate. To recap....don't even wet the reed in your mouth the first time you try it...just put it on the mouthpiece. The reed will take on enough moisture when you play. JP
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: bflatclarinetist
Date: 2005-04-09 03:12
Thanks, arnoldstang. Maybe I should buy that rico bag that you mentioned. I'll try not wetting it.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2005-04-09 14:33
This is for new reeds. The bag...you can just use a ziploc if you want . This is good for winter conditions / high altitude/ low humidity. In the summer a reed case is fine. I would suggest one that totally covers the reed such as Selmer. In nice weather pretty well anything works but I would still suggest starting the new reeds dry. JP
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: Clarino20
Date: 2005-04-09 19:52
OK, you are an intermediate student, want the immediate fix, and a playable reed that will last you a while I am guessing. My suggestion is get a reed made from a denser cane than Rico's PLEEEEEEEEEEEEASSSSSSSSEEEEE. Although it may be easier and faster to play it is like the difference between particle board (flimsy wood) and oak (nice very heavy wood). I would suggest a Vandoren V12, Vandoren Blue Box, or Gonzales/ Zonda 2 1/2. Get a small cup, fill it with warm water, dip your reed in tip first and watch the water rise up through the butt of the reed when this is done play test it. If it isn't a very good sound here is what you do until you get the sound you want. Get a flat surface such as a glass slab or piece of plexi-glass and tap or glue a piece of fine grit wet dry sand paper onto it. Take the back of your reed and sand down the flat part so if it is warped you can refurbish it. then put it back into the water and watch the water rise up. Your reed should be ready to go. Make sure you soak your reeds in water everytime before you play. A denser reed will give you more overtones in your sound but if your reed is dry it wont play very well when the weather changes.
Corey
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