 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: rbell96
Date: 2004-01-03 17:12
Hi,
Has anyone got any advice on the K581 Quintet? Any links or writings i can look at on this work?
Thanks,
Rob
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-01-03 18:28
Much has been written.. what are you trying to find? ...GBK
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-01-04 08:42
rbell96 said:
> I just want opinions, history, interpretation etc
In that case:
Opinion: "...the foundation-stone of every piece ever written in this form..." - Jack Brymer
History: Written at the same time as Così fan tutte
Interpretation: "A unique dialogue among 5 friends, who, at times will argue, show great compassion, laugh together and finally, exhibit lasting camaraderie" - Glenn B Kantor
...GBK
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Author: donald
Date: 2004-01-05 09:14
in some (heavily edited) editions.
believe me, it's in 4
donald
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Author: Gretchen
Date: 2004-01-06 03:22
I just played the piece this semester. Make sure when playing it with your quintet that you learn it well enough to get your eyes out of the music and onto each other. Many times 2 instruments will play the same line in harmony, and you must listen and look at each other to be together. Make sure also to listen to the piano and get out of thier way when they have an important line. Listening is the most important factor to any ensemble piece.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-01-06 04:01
Gretchen wrote:
> Make sure also
> to listen to the piano and get out of thier way when they have
> an important line
There is no piano in K.581 ...GBK
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Author: donald
Date: 2004-01-06 06:15
sorry if my postings sound a bit terse- it's just that this has been an issue with EVERY quartet i've ever played this with (so for me a bit of a dead horse). And EVERY clarinet player i've ever talked to about it (including my 3 major teachers) agree it's in 4 not 2. The Boosey edition of this piece has the Clarinet part in 4 and piano reduction in 2, just to further confuse students doing it for exams etc. When i go to the library next i'll check the Urtext (though there is no autograph) but i believe the most reliable sources have it in 4. (i won't be at the library for another week probably).
GBK might shed some light...????
this sounds like an insignificant issue, but it can make a huge difference to interpretation, esp if strings are thinking in 2 and clarinet in 4
i know my original posting may not have seemed very forthcoming advice wise, but actually this really has always been the only significant problem i've had rehearsing this work in terms of interpretive issues. (of course that doesn't mean that there are no challenges involved).
donald
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-01-06 08:12
Donald ... Although some editions (International, Peters) have the first movement incorrectly notated in cut time, I believe that you will find the Barenreiter edition shows 4/4 ...GBK
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Author: Liquorice
Date: 2004-01-06 11:59
"play the 1st mvt in 4 not 2"
Sorry- I read that wrong. I was thinking:
play the 4th mvt in 2 not 4!!!
Barenreiter indeed shows first movement in 4/4.
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Author: elmo lewis
Date: 2004-01-08 01:11
I've seen editions where the 4th mvt. is marked Allegro and others that are marked Allegretto. ¿Which is correct?
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Author: diz
Date: 2004-01-08 19:53
the two or four question in the work depends entirely on interpretation, as Mozart never used metronome indications (for obvious reasons) one can only speculate on what he felt allegro should be (or any other tempo).
One of the things I don't like about the authentic movement: they are just NOT authentic because no audio record exists ... it is pure conjecture. This doesn't stop me from owning the complete Mozart, Beethoven, Schuman & Brahms symphonies in authentic recordings ... I do prefer their sound ... at least they got the instruments right (in most cases).
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-01-08 20:29
diz wrote:
> One of the things I don't like about the authentic movement:
> they are just NOT authentic because no audio record exists ...
> it is pure conjecture.
Not to mention the fact that in some cases (Mozart K.622) no manuscript exists either...GBK
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2004-01-08 20:44
Just remembered. I also posted an analysis and thoughts on interpretation of the 3rd movement of the Mozart Quintet at http://test.woodwind.org/Databases/Logs/2001/02/000977.txt
This provoked a storm of responses, particularly about the dance character of the second trio, in which the Mozart authority Dan Leeson was a leading combatant. You can retrieve them by searching the Klarinet archives on the words Mozart and landler.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Liquorice
Date: 2004-01-08 20:55
"One of the things I don't like about the authentic movement: they are just NOT authentic because no audio record exists ... it is pure conjecture. "
I don't believe that anybody is seriously trying to be "authentic" nowadays. The label was given to the first musicians and groups who started to perform music of the past on the instruments for which is was written. But in this context it is a misnomer. Otherwise we should be encouraging the audience to talk and socialise during the Overture, as they certainly would have done in Mozart's time!
Although some things are pure conjecture, a study of performing practice can give musicians the knowledge and ability to make informed choices about how they perform music. An informed choice is better than mere speculation!
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Author: diz
Date: 2004-01-08 22:24
Liquorice - yes, indeed, however ... no amount of study on contemporary tomes (Leopold Mozart, Quantz, et cetera) will give you anything but a method ... musicians of the day were (still are) peasants, the idea that they were "civilised" or "highly cultured" (hence able to make beautiful music) is risible ... they were obviously talented in their chosen instrument (be it the clarinet or the garden hoe) and that's why they got their job. They may very well have worn pretty coats and powdered wigs but this was part and parcel of classical (in my example) performance etiquette.
HC Robins Landon's wonderful Haydn books have extraordinary details about the daily drudgery of life at Estahaza (for exmaple) and life was horrid, mostly. Wives were left in the capital and the musicians lived in dormitory style situations and were given huge workloads (often as many as a hundred operas per year), crappy allowances and were beaten by the overlords for recalcitrance.
I'd have been in the stocks most of the time for my unruly tongue, not a happy life.
Without music, the world would be grey, very grey.
Post Edited (2004-01-08 22:27)
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