 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: latb
Date: 2009-01-06 04:47
I have a newbie question, trying to get some advice on how to overcome a brick wall that I hit when I took up the clarinet.
It was more or less on a whim that I bought a cheap plastic clarinet (an old Buffet B12) a couple of years back, "just to try". I'm really playing classical guitar and a bit piano. Well, I tried and immediately got hooked on the sound of the clarinet, and in general playing a "melody" instrument. I love the sustained notes and the espressivo of the clarinet, so much richer than playing the piano or guitar!
I actually started to take lessons, initially, for maybe 15 weeks, which however I stopped with too much job-related travel etc.
Also, I always found playing (or rather, producing the sound, I have less problems with the fingering) difficult, and in particular physically challenging! I think I learned the basics of how to provide air support etc, and I think I have some idea how to form the embouchure.
But I find myself to always having *too much* air, getting out of breath because I can't get rid of air through the clarinet (so at the end of a phrase I have to breath out *a lot* before breathing in again).
Even simple and short pieces make me breathless and powered-out. After the last week of daily "long tone" exercises I literally feel the muscles around my chest ache!
Now, my question is, how hard *should* it be to blow the clarinet, how much resistance is expected? Is this just how it is supposed to be, at least initially, and I just have to practice more and/or get used to it?
Or could it be that there's something wrong with my instrument? I never had a chance to try another clarinet, although I tried different reed strengths and even bought a new mouthpiece, a Vandoren B45-dot. I get a decent "large" tone using a Vandoren 2 1/2, and a much nicer tone with a 3, but my embouchure is not strong enough really to support a 3 or 3 1/2 yet.
But the breathing resistance is the killer for me. At some point I even rented a Tenor Sax to find out if that worked better, and indeed, it was so much easier to get a good strong tone -- but a veto from my family who hated the sound of it stopped that -- they love to hear the clarinet though!
Anyway, after a few months I just gave up, for a year or so, until recently. But I'm still hooked on the clarinet and so I gave it another try over the last weeks.
I'm writing this to find out and decide if I should finally give up and return to the polyphonic solitude of my guitar and piano, or if people think there is a chance to get beyond this. Should I consider getting another/better clarinet (which I certainly would, if I had reasonable assurance to get over this pain)? Or should I just invest the time of a few painful weeks of daily "long tone" exercises and it will all work out? Or is playing the clarinet really just a physical pain in the neck (lungs?) and wimps like me should stay away from the instrument?
As you can tell, I'd really love to give it another try, but will I have a chance to succeed?
Please help!
Thanks and best regards, LatB
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2009-01-06 05:32
Well first thing is to see if you can get lessons. Doesn't have to be a professional teacher at a local university or some hot shot symphonic player. Just find someone who can play and seems mature enough and can communicate well enough to help you learn.
Hopefully you remember the embouchure after a year. It's not as loose as a sax embouchure can be. As a general rule, I put my bottom lip about where the reed starts to touch the curve of a mouthpiece. Then place your tongue against the reed, and gently pull the clarinet into your body. That's what makes the pressure against the reed. Not biting, just keeping the clarinet in and your mouth in a good embouchure.
Here's something you can try. Put the clarinet in your mouth, relax, and hold your tongue up against the reed. And just breathe through the clarinet. I was told to think of "hot air" (like you were fogging up a window). Don't blow as if you were trying to make a sound. Relax your embouchure, just hold your tongue against the reed and breathe through the instrument. This is just to show yourself just how much air can go through that instrument even in that narrow slit of the mouthpiece in a short space of time.
Then start to focus that hot air into a cool stream working on making it focused. A steady, strong stream of air, but make still push a lot of through. I was told to think of it as though blowing through large straw and trying to make a dimple in a glass of water as opposed to a coffee stirrer like I used to make it (I used to compress my air too much and it was thin and weak).
And lastly, what I would do is start that stream of air, start it strong trying to get it to a strong stream right away, and prolong it (count to eight or something). When it's focused and steady (shouldn't take more than a second) just 'release' the reed with your tongue. Pull your tongue away from the reed. If all goes well (crossing fingers) you should get a strong sound.
Hope this helps a little. Maybe others can go through what I said here and clarify it as I'm not what people might call, "so good with the words". Especially lately . . . seems my brain has been thinking faster than my mouth causing slurred speech and mixed syllables. Thanks goodness I'm typing on my keyb-omputer. Darn it!!!!
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-01-06 06:45
Imagine the air coming out of your mouth as a single entity. A flowing stream, that you are in control of. As you play (or just "mess around" blowing random notes, it helps!) notice where the air gets "restricted" and where the stream flows freely. This can help you adjust keys, or make notes as to what notes/styles/gaps work better than others. Sometimes the "restrictive" part is the mouthpiece/reed combo. Get some softer ones and some harder ones and try it out.
When I practiced my "technique" above (I don't really know how to put it into better words, it's something you have to "feel") I noticed that on some days I had a better time with one reed/mp combo than others. For example; I usually play on a Hite Premier mouthpiece with Rico Reserve (very expensive :( ) 3.5s, but on my custom-faced Pomarico Crystal I liked playing with softer Vandoren/Rico (or Rico Royale) 2-2.5s. For some reason, the softer reeds with the more "restrictive" mouthpiece just felt more "free flowing."
I don't know exactly what I'm trying to say. I'm no pro by ANY means (barely an amateur/hobbyist) but I can get a "feel" for what works best. It's nice if you have a little extra cash and/or time to try out many different things, but sometimes you just have to trust your intuition. Blowing on a clarinet shouldn't be hard by any means, but I've noticed that I can play on a harder reed/mp combo now, just two months later, than I EVER could before. Taste a bit of every piece of the clarinet world, and you'll find your favorite setup. Stick with that.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-01-06 06:55
You should be breathing rather than blowing.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2009-01-06 12:35
The simple answer to your main question is - No, it shouldn't be so hard or taxing, even at the very beginning.
You don't really say whether the sound that results from all your effort is a full, free tone or a thin, quiet one, or a fuzzy, airy one. The problem is almost certainly _in part_ with the equipment you're playing, but it could be a leaky clarinet, a mouthpiece with a damaged facing or table (the part the reed sits against) or just reeds that don't work well with the mouthpiece you're using.
What did your teacher say about all of this? The topic must have come up during those lessons over 15 weeks. He/she would have had the best chance of judging what might be wrong by hearing the sound you are producing.
Exhaling before taking in a new breath is more or less normal technique in situations where there is time for it. If you only top off the air in your lungs with quick, short breaths you quickly have little but oxygen-depleted air in your lungs, which can predictably lead to feelings of breathlessness and eventually fatigue (think how you'd feel under water or just "holding your breath" after a half-minute or so even with a lungful of air). Leaving aside the question of resistance for a minute, are you breathing in very often while you play, even if you still have air left? Before they're taught to articulate with the tongue, a lot of beginners separate notes by stopping the air and taking very short breaths between notes. Could there be some vestige of this left in your playing even though you no doubt know how to articulate correctly? Obviously, this wouldn't explain a problem with long tones, but breathing too often without using the air up (expelling the depleted air) might in some way be involved in your overall discomfort.
Another thing that can cause you to "bottle up" all the air and not use it up in playing a phrase might be that you're pinching the reed off and the air just isn't going through. That's one thing that can be heard in the sound you're producing, but unless you're able to listen objectively enough while you're struggling so much, it may be hard for you to judge whether or not this is part of the problem. Again, a mismatch of reed and mouthpiece or a distorted facing could encourage this, and it might take more experienced ears to sort out the problem.
A teacher would be your best bet. I'd disagree to an extent with sfalexi - you should be looking for a professional teacher who plays the clarinet well. It doesn't need to be a university professor, and I don't know if a "hot shot symphonic player" (given what "hot shot" implies) would take on a beginner in any case. But there should be many teachers in your area who can help with these kinds of problems, and many of them will be flexible about accommodating lesson schedules to your work schedule.
Good luck. It is definitely not as hard to produce a sound as you've experienced, and helping you make it easier shouldn't be a mystery for someone who knows what he/she's doing and can hear what's coming out of your clarinet.
Karl
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Author: Bart
Date: 2009-01-06 13:18
The replies above have covered the breathing issues. One key question still stands and hasn't been answered: "will I have a chance to succeed"?
The key route to success, I think, lies in having fun playing the instrument, and playing with others. That way, you'll have a reason to keep on playing, also when the novelty of the instrument has worn off and you hit a plateau stage in your development. Initial skill building tends to go quite fast. But when your progress becomes slower, or you reach a plateau and don't seem to progress much at all, playing with others in a setting you enjoy can give you a reason to keep on playing. And if you keep on doing that, you'll eventually reach a stage where your progress picks up again. After a couple of years, you'll find that you've made huge progress along the way.
Certainly, having a good teacher helps. But as soon as your playing has reached a level that allows you to join a local community band or some other group that plays music you like, join the band and have fun. The combined effect of having a teacher who guides you and helps you build technical and musical skills (and acts as a source of inspiration) on the one hand and having a setting in which you have fun using those skills (and develop new skills along the way) should bring success in the long run.
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Author: Bassie
Date: 2009-01-06 13:45
> I love the sustained notes and the espressivo of the clarinet
Nicely put!
*
Some good advice above. From personal experience, 2.5 vandoren is OK for B45 dot, but 3 is fairly hard work. There's quite a big gap at the tip of a B45 dot and I can get a lot of air through it. It's /possible/ that you're closing everything off with your embouchure. It /could/ be that you're making the classic beginners' mistake of clamping everything shut to make a hard reed speak - I'd actually suggest a complete beginner start with VanD 2 or Rico brand 2.5 on this mouthpiece - or it /could/ be that you're not taking in quite enough mouthpiece. This gives a cleaner sound than taking too much mouthpiece but can lead to the sound being 'strangled'. Try taking a little more.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-01-06 14:13
And relax - don't stress yourself out.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2009-01-06 14:14)
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2009-01-06 15:25
Karl,
I may have put it badly. I was just trying to express that it doesn't need to be the principle player of a major symphony or a solo recording artist(that's what I would consider a "hot shot" player - someone who's playing is TOP NOTCH!).
But at this level, after not having played for a year, the original poster could proper do with advice and lessons from a clarinet student at a local college, or maybe a principle player of a pretty good community orchestra, or even a local high school music teacher who plays woodwinds.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: latb
Date: 2009-01-07 02:20
Thank you so much, this was great!!
I followed the advice and explored a bit where the resistance really came from. In particular Alexi's approach of trying out to just "breath through" the clarinet without making a tone, it helped to established for myself that I can indeed breath -- and it helped to get rid of the feeling of drowning. Then I explored how to establish a tone without closing up the reed. I had to put the mouthpiece in more than I was used to. I was probably pinching the reed off, as Karl suspected.
I also found that a slightly harder reed (Vandoren V12 3) worked quite well. And having found the right "working point" I then could go back to a softer Vandoren 2.5 without closing it up again. Firm but relaxed, of course I will have to work a lot now on establishing the embouchure better, getting some stamina etc.
I started to look for a teacher here in the western suburbs of Chicago (tips, anyone?), hope I can find somebody with whom I can work out a lesson schedule that allows for my travel. I'm really looking forward to getting lessons again!
The most crucial help you guys gave me was probably the simple statement "no, it should not be that hard".
So thanks again, you people are brilliant. I'm so happy I found this wonderful bboard with so many great contributers!
Thanks and cheers, LatB
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