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 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers
Author: JessKateDD 
Date:   2006-03-30 01:38

Gregory,

Your literal translation of "ad hominem" is correct. However, in practice, an ad hominem argument can be used against one or more individuals. For example, this is from Wikipedia:

"An ad hominem fallacy consists of asserting that someone's argument is wrong and/or they are wrong to argue at all purely because of something discreditable/not-authoritative about the person or those persons cited by them rather than addressing the soundness of the argument itself."


You also mischaracterized my views on the use of medicine. I take medicine every day for allergies. As for "psychological deficits", I have a family member with schizophrenia who must take drugs to function rationally. And I certainly would not deny beta blockers to someone with a heart condition or a severe anxiety disorder. 1/4 of all professional musicians in America were using beta blockers in 1987, and I have no doubt that number is much higher today. I assume that at least 90 percent of these people are not taking beta blockers for medical reasons, but instead are trying to get an edge.

However, from what I am reading from you, you consider anyone who is helped by playing with beta blockers under pressure to be suffering from a "psychological deficit". I do not. Those who are taking beta blockers solely to play a little bit better are guilty of doping.

You constantly cite doctors. Doctors are in the business of prescribing medicine. It is financially advantageous for them to do this. And since the use of beta blockers helps musicians in performance with few side effects (except for the previously mentioned asthmatics and people with low blood pressure), they have no problem prescribing them. However, medical ethics are not the same is what is ethical in general. Athletes are notorious for doping, usually in ways that are not medically harmful either, but people who respect the sport and fair competition see them for what they are - cheaters.

Were musical competitions a huge international sport like the Olympics, I have no doubt that beta blockers would be banned. However, since our little niche is off of most peoples' radar, it is not scrutinized as much.
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 One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Ken Shaw 2006-03-24 17:10 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
crnichols 2006-03-24 17:37 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
LCL 2006-03-24 17:40 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-24 18:36 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
TonkaToy 2006-03-24 19:51 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
johng 2006-03-24 20:13 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
J. J. 2006-03-24 22:40 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Super Mario 2006-03-24 23:20 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
J. J. 2006-03-25 01:09 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Super Mario 2006-03-25 02:29 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-25 02:41 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-25 02:51 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-25 06:45 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
J. J. 2006-03-25 02:58 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-25 08:36 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Morrigan 2006-03-25 10:44 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Markael 2006-03-25 11:28 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-25 11:44 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-25 16:21 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-25 16:50 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-25 17:43 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-25 17:53 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-25 19:03 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
clarnibass 2006-03-25 19:24 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-25 21:16 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-25 22:14 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Mark Charette 2006-03-25 22:21 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-25 22:30 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-27 03:42 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
EEBaum 2006-03-25 22:59 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-25 23:18 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
clarnibass 2006-03-26 04:04 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-26 08:34 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-26 14:16 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
allencole 2006-03-26 16:22 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Mary Jo 2006-03-26 18:34 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
3dogmom 2006-03-26 18:37 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-26 19:26 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
EEBaum 2006-03-26 19:18 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Ken Shaw 2006-03-26 19:52 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
crnichols 2006-03-26 20:14 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Synonymous Botch 2006-03-27 10:28 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
allencole 2006-03-27 14:37 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-27 17:00 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-27 17:08 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-27 17:15 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-27 18:55 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-27 20:12 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-27 20:32 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Mark Charette 2006-03-27 20:59 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-28 05:29 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
clarinetistra 2006-03-27 20:19 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-27 21:06 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-27 21:24 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-27 21:35 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-27 21:50 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Mary Jo 2006-03-27 21:36 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
diz 2006-03-27 22:08 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
EEBaum 2006-03-28 04:59 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 05:13 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
clarnibass 2006-03-28 05:32 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 05:44 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
EEBaum 2006-03-28 06:16 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 07:03 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ghuba 2006-03-28 12:34 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
TonkaToy 2006-03-28 13:45 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-28 17:35 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 18:35 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 18:57 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Brenda Siewert 2006-03-28 19:52 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 20:06 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Liquorice 2006-03-28 20:39 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
DaveF 2006-03-28 22:57 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Meri 2006-03-28 22:36 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
johng 2006-03-28 22:37 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-28 22:42 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
JessKateDD 2006-03-28 22:43 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-28 22:52 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 04:26 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 04:36 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 04:58 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
clarinetistra 2006-03-29 04:37 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-29 05:55 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-29 07:27 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 13:08 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Mary Jo 2006-03-29 14:37 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-29 15:50 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-29 16:09 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 16:47 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
BlockEyeDan 2006-03-29 18:40 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 19:10 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
JessKateDD 2006-03-29 21:17 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-29 23:10 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Old Geezer 2006-03-29 23:39 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-29 23:56 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-30 00:29 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-30 00:57 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-30 01:06 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
mtague 2006-03-30 01:19 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
JessKateDD 2006-03-30 01:38 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
george 2006-03-30 02:35 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-30 02:54 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
EEBaum 2006-03-30 08:06 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Andy 2006-03-30 08:35 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ohsuzan 2006-03-30 12:06 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
clarnibass 2006-03-30 13:02 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-30 13:57 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Brenda Siewert 2006-03-30 15:10 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ghuba 2006-03-30 16:22 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Mark Charette 2006-03-30 16:41 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ghuba 2006-03-30 17:19 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-30 16:06 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-30 16:42 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Gregory Smith 2006-03-30 19:15 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Sylvain 2006-03-30 21:29 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
ginny 2006-03-30 23:05 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
sherman 2006-03-31 14:45 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-03-31 19:19 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
Carol Dutcher 2006-03-31 19:33 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
3dogmom 2006-03-31 20:34 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
DaveF 2006-04-01 08:57 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
tictactux 2006-04-01 11:24 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
EEBaum 2006-04-02 00:13 
 Re: One in Four Classical Musicians Use Beta Blockers  new
CK 2006-04-02 18:14 


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