 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: brahmslove
Date: 2011-09-29 03:47
Hear me out.
I'm currently a high school senior. And I love music. I walk downt eh hallways singing Brahms Symphonies and am simply in love with it. I have been in the top seats at my Honors All State Band and am in a prestigious youth orchestra.
Lately, I have begun to get very stressed when playing clarinet. I'm not a music major but I am still on a high level (I think...) Reeds have bothered me to no end. I detest how they can be stuffy too hard too soft, everything! 4/7 days a week, my "practicing" will consist of playing on a couple reeds, trying to adjust them, and getting stressed and calling it quits for hte day. I have not really "enjoyed" playing clarinet for the past several months. Sometimes, I will start crying out of stress from clarinet.
I love music so much but do you think that it's time to take a break from clarinet? Or is it ok to stop altogether. I've played violin for a month and it was love at first sight. I felt so much happier lpaying. Maybe I, just lazy, but I felt so much freer. And while I know that strings have annoying things of their own, I feel nothing can compare to reeds.
To boot, I have District auditions in a couple weeks and I don't think I would be able to do well when my heart just isn't into it...
Let me know your opinions...
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Author: ThomasG
Date: 2011-09-29 04:15
Honestly, just do what you think is right. If you think you would be much happier playing violin rather than clarinet, then do it. I don't think there is much stopping you.
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Author: davyd
Date: 2011-09-29 04:25
The problem might not be your reeds. Have you tried other mouthpieces? How recently was your clarinet worked on? Have you had any physical ailments recently?
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Author: TJTG
Date: 2011-09-29 04:36
I think you've just reached a wall that needs to be broken down. You see... there comes a time in your musical development where you hear and notice problems you cannot fix. It is good to know that your reeds aren't what they need to be and its something to work through. I'm a senior in college and I ask myself all the time, "how will I ever be good enough?" My reeds dont' play right. My technique is crap. My embouchure needs work. My tone is not what I want it to be. My articulation sounds horrendous (to me).
You have simply gotten caught up in one of many caveats. I today, for example, thought I was biting on a high note. I got caught up in the problem and ended up biting all day. I thought about the problem too much and made it worse.
If you are having trouble with reeds try Thomas Ridenour's reed finishing system. I swear by it as does my professor.
Remember, if you are always happy when you are done practicing it means you're happy with the player you are. BUT. When you are frustrated with yourself it means you're aware of the progress you WANT to make.
Do you take lessons? Maybe your teacher could help you with reed adjustment. Sometimes less is more with those adjustments.
I hope this helps. My email is available if you have more questions.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-09-29 04:43
Honestly if you are spending the majority of your playing time trying to adjust reeds then something is wrong and it's probably not the reeds. Have you discussed the issue with your teacher?
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2011-09-29 05:10
brahmslove wrote:
>
> To boot, I have District auditions in a couple weeks and I
> don't think I would be able to do well when my heart just isn't
> into it...
>
Could you really be more stressed out over the auditions than anything else? It sounds like you're bringing a lot of pressure on yourself - maybe putting such high hopes on your audition result that you're tensing and pressing much too hard. I've found over a lot of years (decades) that reed problems come and go, mostly with the weather (autumn and spring are the worst, when humidity and atmospheric pressure can change drastically day to day) and the level of performance pressure I feel. It may be that, as a senior, you are simply putting too much pressure on yourself to play your best District audition ever. There's no such issue for you with the violin - you're not at that level and maybe feel you have less to prove.
Several things may help. Over the next few days: (1) make sure, as already suggested, that your instrument is in the best possible playing condition; (2) find some etudes or solo pieces in your music collection that you already know and play them - a hair under tempo and with a goal of being as relaxed as possible; (3) buy a box of reeds a half strength softer than you normally play and see how relaxed you can be with them - even if you don't prefer the sound and have no intention of using them in the long term.
You could consider pulling out of the audition, but if you've learned the solo and are comfortable with it, just finding ways to relax and enjoy the music may be enough to get you through this patch of turbulence. That's all it is, after all, no more lasting than the rough patches airliners go through routinely during hundreds of flights daily. Most players, especially young ones, go through these periods from time to time when nothing seems to work. Dealing with them is part of the process of learning to play the instrument.
Karl
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Author: scot455
Date: 2011-09-29 06:47
Have you seen Tom Ridenour as billyboy647 on facebook dealing with clarinet reeds?
I speak as a very satisfied customer of his ATG system -- he solved the problem of reeds for me in 20 minutes of reading his amazing technique.
Good Luck and Be Safe !!!!!
Ivan
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-09-29 10:19
Humidity........ it's the heating systems for indoors that is causing problems (drying out your reeds).
Two things:
First for sanity, have a Legere reed or two on hand to keep you level headed (1/4 strength lower than you use in cane).
Second, try a three day (four or five in transition seasons and winter) break-in period where you just play on each reed for five minutes (five minutes ONLY), then put it away for the next day. After three days, they should be good to play for most lengths of time. Without break-in I find reeds just get water logged or can't remain consistant during a playing session.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: oboesax
Date: 2011-09-29 11:41
Find an oboe and play that for a week. Then go back to clarinet and see how relatively easy the reeds are to deal with (my daughter plays both, and that's what she'd tell you).
Seriously, you're a senior. As a mom of three I know you've got to be stressing about a lot of other things right now. You've gotten some good advice above regarding reeds, but remember that your general stress level will carry over and have an effect on your clarinet playing.
My daughter's teachers tell her not to stress over reeds. Spend a little time on it, but after a while just put the reed on and play.
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Author: escher
Date: 2011-09-29 12:52
Just to add to what the others have said - And this is coming from more of a drummer / guitar player so YMMV...
Periodically, you have to step back and remember why you enjoy the instrument in the first place. Take a break from playing and explore artists that inspire you. As said previously - find something you play well and relax and play it... Don't read the music - Play it... feel the music and let your emotions out through the playing - don't worry so much about timing and phrasing - play for the sake of playing. Speak through the instrument.
Its easy to become mechanical about your playing, lifeless... the purpose is to express yourself. Of course the technical details (Like reed quality and balance, etc)are important, but if they make you hate the process - then what good is it?
I am a strong believer in spending time "noodling" every time you practice... exploring the instrument free form... experimenting and getting out of your comfort zone, learning to "speak" musically..
Remember - Pushing yourself is good, and thats how you improve, but never at the expense of the soul of the music.
You would be better served playing at a bit lower level and doing it well, with enjoyment, than playing at a higher level and stressing so much that you hate the process.
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Author: Philcoman
Date: 2011-09-29 13:55
I can second what a lot of people on the board are saying, but I particularly like what oboesax and eacher said -- you're at a point in your life when you're facing a lot of stress, changes, and challenges, and you owe it to yourself to look for areas where you can cut yourself some slack. Since you're not a music major you can afford to play your clarinet simply for the joy of it, and anything that gets in the way of that can be put aside. Don't necessarily put aside your clarinet -- put aside the expectations that make it a chore instead of a pleasure. Definitely get some Legere reeds; follow some of the advice of the other people on this board; play what you want when you want for a while; and let clarinet practice again become something you can wait to do.
"If you want to do something, you do it, and handle the obstacles as they come." --Benny Goodman
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2011-09-29 14:18
Every clarinet player can relate to the problems you're having with reeds. You're not alone in feeling frustrated at times. But quitting in the face of these difficulties seems a radical solution.
One of my former teachers, a famous player, used to say that a good part of the battle with reeds is psychological. He would tell me to regard a particular reed as the only reed I had available at the moment. He would force me to play on it and to make the best of it, even if it was really quite inadequate. I would have a heck of time but after a while, the most amazing thing would happen. I would begin to relax and to listen more closely and to find ways to achieve the musical ends I was after (this, it turns out, is the very thing he was trying to teach me, to think more about the music and less about the reed).
Try it. Pick up any old reed and just play. Practice something: long tones, scales, intervals, articulation, attacks, short phrases, studies, etudes, anything at all. But here's the key. Forget about the reed. Concentrate only on the music and what you are trying to achieve. Resist the overpowering urge to change the reed or do any kind of fixing or adjusting. Just play music.
You may find, as I did (and still do), that your love of music and the clarinet transcends the vagaries of the fickle reed.
Post Edited (2011-09-29 14:25)
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2011-09-29 15:29
David B. raises an interesting point. What actually is your current setup -- clarinet, mouthpiece, reeds, and ligature?
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: epssax
Date: 2011-09-29 15:44
You have put a lot of your life in getting to the level you are now. You have hit a wall. Everyone has given you good suggestions. The reed and mouthpiece are critical. Two ways to do it: 1. soft reed and open mouthpiece 2. Hard reed and closed mouthpiece. (tip opening)
Make sure your tip is not warped!
I had my clarinet adjusted by a master clarinet specialist and it was like a different clarinet! It made so much difference I had him overhaul it. My horn was never that subtle, responsive, and easy to play before--not even from the factory.
Good luck.
Been playing clarinet 53 years. Studied with Jim Elliott and James Livingston in Louisville. Been a professional musician 51 years. Play a Buffet R-13. Also play a Buffet tenor sax, Martin Baritone sax, Jupiter also sax. www.thecountryclarinet.com
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-09-29 16:29
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> Why am I guessing that your reed is probably a 4.5?
>
> If you are using popsicle sticks as reeds, they will give you
> trouble.
>
That's entirely possible depending on the teacher or band director. When I was in high school I was constantly encouraged to play on stronger and stronger reeds and told that "softer reeds were for beginners". I never really liked the very hard reeds and this pretty much resulted in me not playing in college much at all. I curse the fact that I never really learned anything about mouthpieces until later in life. If I had the setup I do now (more open mouthpiece with a #3 reed) back when I was in high school I probably would have enjoyed playing a lot more and would be a better player than I am now as a result.
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Author: weberfan
Date: 2011-09-29 17:26
brahmslove...
a lot of good suggestions and commiseration in this thread.
just wanted to share a phrase from my teacher (I'm an adult returnee to the clarinet).
when I first started playing again and asking questions about reeds and mouthpieces and alternative fingerings---and briefly becoming overwhelmed by all I would need to know---he said: "You know, you never come to the end of clarinet."
That actually put me at ease. There is no end to what you can learn or improve upon. And that probably applies to the violin, too. You just have to find a way to approach it.
It's hard to tell completely what may be at the real root of your frustration---just reeds? or are they a substitute for something that's really eating at you?
If reeds are driving you nuts, there's plenty of solid advice above.
Best of luck.
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Author: William
Date: 2011-09-29 18:37
After a lifetime spent dealing with reed problems, I decided--just before a performance of "Peter & the Wolf"--to try playing a new Forestone reed....and have never returned to cane reeds, V12's or any other brand. I got wonderful compliments from the conductor, fellow orchestra members and several audience patrons--especially on my "sound". It has been so much nicer not having to do reed searchs before concerts and to never have to work on reeds--just being able to play the music without having to stress over playing the reed. I am now using Forestone reeds on all of my clarinets and saxophones and have never felt more in control of my sound and musical expression.
Before you quit clarinet, give Forestone reeds a try.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2011-09-29 19:05
For me, dealing with reeds was sort of like learning to ski. Infinitely frustrating for a while, but all of a sudden I had an epiphany and just "got it". Since then, no big deal. While the suggestions to use synthetic reeds are very good, I wouldn't necessarily give up on cane.
For instant depression relief, consider how much better off you are than those poor oboists and bassoonists --- whose reeds do double-duty as their mouthpiece, thus combining the two most problematic items of woodwind equipment into one small piece of fragile and highly variable organic randomness!
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Author: Carol Dutcher
Date: 2011-09-29 22:57
I can relate so well to the reed problem. I have been playing for 15 years, and still have problems with reeds. When I find a good one (!) I will keep it on the horn until it is practically in shreds. Well no, not really, but I know exactly what you mean.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2011-09-29 23:16
Carol Dutcher wrote:
> I can relate so well to the reed problem. I have been playing
> for 15 years, and still have problems with reeds.
That's what I thought I had as well. Until I decided to consciously stop worrying and simply play what's there. Ever since then, I just worry about pieces on my stand.
Doesn't mean I wouldn't get caught by this issue some day again. Might be a recurring thing.
--
Ben
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2011-09-30 03:18
Brahmslove,
Your setup sounds compatible to me. When was the last time you lubricated your Rovner ligature?
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2011-09-30 08:40
My guess is also that maybe your reeds are too hard. I played on a Greg Smith 1* for a while and found it to be really reed un-friendly; I just couldn't find a reed strength that worked on it! I moved to the Chicago model and find that 3.5 works really well on it. I also started using traditional reeds and like the results better than the sometimes stubborn V12s.
I've learned in recent years that I work really well when my equipment is really middle-of-the-road. I make sure that it is easy to play and there is little room for error. Some people play on equipment that they think makes them sound good, but actually gives them nothing but trouble and they struggle with it. Maybe you need to try mouthpieces and pick something that is quite simply easy to play and sound good? That would certainly make you enjoy playing more!
I went through a very frustrating time with reeds when I was in college. It turns out that it was an extremely steep and frustrating learning curve and then, suddenly, I knew what I was doing with reeds and can thankfully say that I've encountered very few problems with reeds since.
To sum up what I am thinking the solution is: Try softer reeds, and experiment with mouthpieces.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2011-09-30 10:07
If you want to try an experiment, get a box of the Rico reserve classics # 3.5
They are extremely consistent right out of the box. That could easily eliminate a headache.
Then focus on the enjoyment of making music, not going from one competition to another. Even a weekend off can refresh.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: LesleyM
Date: 2011-09-30 14:20
Come on brahmslove,
There is no need to stress out about these things. I guess there are a lot of things building up here and the "nightmare" with reeds is just a symptom of everything else. So give yourself a break. Forget the auditions. No one is forcing you to do them.
As far as reeds go, I am in full agreement with everyone else, try somethign softer. I also fell into the "only beginners play soft reeds" trap and worked my way up to 3.5 or 4. Then, after a 20 yr break, got back to my clari's and now play on a 2.5 plastic. I do see people blaming reeds for what is actually a completely different problem. I find if you make miniscule adjustments to the position of the reed on the mouthpiece you can find a compatible position.
It is worth investigating a different mouthpiece as well. I have a vandoren A1 and a selmer B45. they are very similar yet I can play a dream with the V but the S is a little bugger!
So, to summarise, chill. You do this for pleasure, remember?
Lx
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2011-09-30 21:55
You said you find yourself loving to play the violin. I say run with that! See where it takes you. You may never look back, or you may find yourself going back to the clarinet in a month.
I switched from flute to clarinet in high school and never looked back, and to this day really don't have a desire to play it. Lately I have a hankering for hand percussion, and would be all over that if I could spare the time.
In any case, absolutely take time off once in a while. Treat it as a detox. And don't beat yourself up too much about district auditions. Perhaps this pseudocrisis you're having could open doors to musical avenues you hadn't previously considered.
My first recommendation, which is my recommendation to just about anyone who so much as looks at a musical instrument, would be to play in a context other than an institutionalized ensemble.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: scot455
Date: 2011-10-02 08:13
Tom Ridenours ATG system solved all my reed problems (as he stated)
You can watch him on youtube as billyboy647
Good Luck and Be Safe !!!!!
Ivan
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Author: crnichols
Date: 2011-10-03 06:48
I think there is some great advice in this thread. I don't think the subject is the answer, but I think you can gain a great deal by working through your dilemma.
There are obstacles in life. “Obstacles are things a person sees when he takes his eyes off his goal.” What is your goal? Making music!
Music shouldn't be an obstacle, it should be a goal! It should enrich your life with joy and appreciation daily. It presents constant challenges. If you to look at a challenge in the eye, assess it, and work through it, you'll accomplish something really remarkable. Do you have a mentor/teacher that might help you in this way?
Reeds are organic, so they change! I use different strengths in the summer and winter so I can always find something functional (it's never perfect, but "it is what it is"). Legere reeds might provide you with some temporary or even permanent sanity.
Experiment and search, ask questions (you already done this, but keep it up!). Remember, the process is just as important as the result.
Christopher Nichols, D.M.A.
Assistant Professor of Clarinet
University of Delaware
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Author: luvtheclarinet
Date: 2011-10-20 17:58
Hi
I have been playing the clarinet for a while now. I find myself also getting very frustrated with it at times." It has taken me a while to figure out why that is because I luv the clarinet and to me there is no other instrument. I love the sound of it, I love the challenge of it. (easy to play, difficult to master). What I don't like is getting the right reed, the problems with tuning, the constant replacing of the corks and pads, mouthpiece issues and the list goes on and on. Also depending on my mood, I sometimes don't sound as good. What I want to play is beautiful music and that is the goal I will continue to work towards. I hope that helps for you to know that most of us go through the same struggles with the clarinet. I have finally found a reed brand and size that seems to work for me most of the time so that is helping. I still have not found the "just right" mouthpiece. You sound like a beautiful clarinetist, and I think the clarinet is a very difficult instrument to play beautifully. Definitely give it some thought.
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2011-10-20 18:54
A few years ago, I stopped worrying about equipment. I set a standard that I would play on anything that didn't absolutely suck balls. If the reed plays well enough, I play it. No more searching for mouthpieces, ligatures, etc., once I find one that plays well enough. If I'm in a situation where new equipment is handy, I try it out and see if it is an improvement... if it is, I switch. But I do not seek these out. I take any given instrument to a technician about every 2 years, or if there's a pressing problem.
It's liberating. Try it.
I think there's a distinction between "playing clarinet" and "making music, and happening to use clarinet as the instrument". If you get yourself into the latter mindset, micromanaging your equipment becomes less important. There's a lot more "you" involved in playing clarinet than you may think. If anything, this makes you flexible enough to handle day-to-day changes and equipment malfunctions.
I know this probably seems strange coming from a guy that sells clarinet equipment, but that's my situation and my recommendation.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2011-10-20 20:09
Legere Reeds + compatible mouthpiece. I'm using Walter Grabner's mouthpiece and it works great.
Granted, it's not as good as that REALLY good reed, but on a scale of one to ten (ten being that PERFECT performance reed you get once in a blue moon), this combination yields me the comfort of about an 8 to 9. VERY consistent, VERY playable, sounds VERY good, and it's SO nice just to play and work on music and not be frustrated with reeds.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: curiousclarinetist
Date: 2011-10-20 20:52
"What nobody tells people who are beginners — and I really wish someone had told this to me . . . is that all of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But there is this gap. For the first couple years you make stuff, and it’s just not that good. It’s trying to be good, it has potential, but it’s not.
But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your taste is why your work disappoints you. A lot of people never get past this phase. They quit. Most people I know who do interesting, creative work went through years of this. We know our work doesn’t have this special thing that we want it to have. We all go through this. And if you are just starting out or you are still in this phase, you gotta know it’s normal and the most important thing you can do is do a lot of work. Put yourself on a deadline so that every week you will finish one story.
It is only by going through a volume of work that you will close that gap, and your work will be as good as your ambitions. And I took longer to figure out how to do this than anyone I’ve ever met. It’s gonna take awhile. It’s normal to take awhile. You’ve just gotta fight your way through."
Ira Glass
Curious Clarinetist
http://curiousclarinetist.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Curious-Clarinetist/155848744465821
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