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Klarinet Archive - Posting 000449.txt from 2000/07

From: Dan Leeson <leeson0@-----.net>
Subj: Re: [kl] Whether or not we should do the repeats in K581 M&Trio
Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2000 19:13:53 -0400

Tony, I am in Salt Lake City, but that does not matter anyway because I don't
have a copy of the first edition of 581 and don't know what it says in any
case. But I doubt very much if it says anything other than Da Capo becuase that
was the standard in almost every minuet and trio.

It would be an unusual event to say anything else, though Mozart does say
something else in the piano quartet when he writes "Da Capo, le repliche
piano." In the manuscript of the Gran Partitta (but not the minuet, it's the
Romanze) he writes "Da Capo Senza Repliche."

But I assert once again, whatever the first edition says has no standing and
cannot be relied upon to be derived from what Mozart wrote.

Dan

Tony Pay wrote:

> On Sat, 08 Jul 2000 01:55:50 +0100, Tony@-----.uk said:
>
> > On Fri, 07 Jul 2000 14:44:48 -0700, leeson0@-----.net said:
> >
> > > Tony Pay wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Fri, 07 Jul 2000 06:03:41 -0700, leeson0@-----.net said:
> > > >
> > > > > If, as you say, the Barenreiter edition of the the quintet says
> > > > > "senza replica" that is an editorial addition to the edition. The
> > > > > editor would have no way of knowing what the manuscript said.
> > > >
> > > > What you mean is, it's not in the first edition, right?
> > >
> > > The first edition of that work has no more authority or authenticity
> > > than any other edition. The fact that it was the first printed
> > > version gives it no patina of authority. Early editions can often be
> > > the worst sources. It may be exactly what Mozart wrote or it could
> > > contain 1000 differences in pitch, dynamics, phrasings, even music.
> >
> > It's just that we're trying to decide whether the 'senza replica' in the
> > Barenreiter is by Mozart or is editorial.
>
> Aren't we?
>
> > Given that Mozart's manuscript is unavailable, the best source is the
> > first edition.
> >
> > If 'senza replica' appears in the first edition, then our best guess
> > is that Mozart wrote it, as opposed to leaving the matter to
> > performance practice.
>
> If not, why not?
>
> > If 'senza replica' isn't in the first edition, it's simply the opinion
> > of the Barenreiter editor.
>
> Agreed?
>
> > Does it, in fact, appear in the first edition? I'm sorry to say I
> > have no copy in front of me.
> >
> > Tony
>
> I'd really like a reply to this; I don't think it's too much to ask.
>
> Of course, if I don't get one, I'll find out by some other means.
>
> I don't do the repeats the second and third time anyway, but purely as a
> matter of my own personal judgement.
>
> Tony
> --
> _________ Tony Pay
> |ony:-) 79 Southmoor Rd Tony@-----.uk
> | |ay Oxford OX2 6RE GMN family artist: www.gmn.com
> tel/fax 01865 553339
>
> Blessed is the lion that the man will devour, and the lion will become man.
> And loathsome is the man that the lion will devour,
> and the lion will become man.
>
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