Klarinet Archive - Posting 000081.txt from 2011/07
From: Howard Braithwaite <h.braithwaite@-----.uk>
Subj: Re: [kl] Klarinet Digest, Vol 17, Issue 13
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 18:06:24 -0400
Oehler is=A0 also=A0widely used in Austria, although not exclusively.
Howard B (UK)
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Sent: Tue, 12 July, 2011 13:46:50
Subject: Klarinet Digest, Vol 17, Issue 13
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Today's Topics:
=A0 1. Re: Klarinet Digest, Vol 17, Issue 11 (Gary Van Cott)
=A0 2. Re: albert? (Bill Hausmann)
=A0 3. Re: albert? (Deborah Marshall)
=A0 4. Re: albert? (Martin Marks)
=A0 5. Re: albert? (corvo di bassetto)
=A0 6. Re: albert? (Martin Baxter)
=A0 7. Re: albert? (Finn Jespersen)
=A0 8. Re: albert? ( Georg K?hner )
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 15:19:08 -0700
From: Gary Van Cott <gary@-----.com>
Subject: Re: [kl] Klarinet Digest, Vol 17, Issue 11
To: The Klarinet Mailing List <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <4E1B76DC.5010605@-----.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-1
Howard Klug (as far as I know).
Gary
+---------------------------------------------------------------------
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On 7/11/2011 3:14 PM, Howard Braithwaite wrote:
Professor at Indiana University (whose name I can't
> remember - possibly Howard Klug?). If he needs them who are we mere morta=
ls to =
> argue?!
> =
> Howard Braithwaite (from the UK)
> =
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 19:35:56 -0500
From: "Bill Hausmann" <bhausmann1@-----.net>
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: "'The Klarinet Mailing List'" <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <003501cc402b$aa219240$fe64b6c0$@net>
Content-Type: text/plain;=A0=A0=A0 charset=3D"iso-8859-1"
Only meant as a joke (on me as well -- note my last name).=A0 But it IS
strange that the opinion that the Oehler system is superior seems to exist
only in a relatively small and concentrated area of the world.
Bill Hausmann
If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Finn Jespersen [mailto:fj4800@-----.dk]
> Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 4:41 PM
> To: klarinet@-----.com
> Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
> =
> =
> Hi Bill and List! I don?t think that one uses the Oehler system just
> because one does not want to use a frensh system! As far as I know the
> Oehler system is required in every german orchestra because it mixes
> better with the other woodwind instruments and because it sounds better
> than the Boehm system (more soft). In other words, they have another
> idiom! Isn?t that ok? Remember that some of the best clarinettists in
> the world plays the Oehler system, Sabine Meyer and Karl Leister!
> =
> > From: bhausmann1@-----.net
> > Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 13:41:16 -0500
> > To: klarinet@-----.com
> > Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
> >
> > Sounds like Oehler system to me, nearly universal in Germany, I
> suppose just because they don't want to use a French system.=A0 :-)
> >
> > Bill Hausmann
> >
> > If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
> >
> >=A0 Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > On Jul 11, 2011, at 10:56 AM, Mikko Raasakka
> <mikkoraasakka@-----.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Dear colleagues!
> > >
> > > Does anyone recognize the model of the clarinet shown here?
> > >
> > >
> https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=3D2&ik=3D5e87f981d9&view=3Datt&th=3D1311=
7c93c2
> 50814c&attid=3D0.2&disp=3Dinline&zw
> > >
> > > for me it looks like some kind of advanced Albert model clarinet
> with added
> > > low Eb.
> > >
> > > The photo is taken in the late 1930's an the man who holds the horn
> is Matti
> > > Rajula (1905-1944), the solo clarinet of the=A0 Finnish Radio
> Orchestra.
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Klarinet mailing list
> > > Klarinet@-----.com
> > > To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> > > http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > Klarinet mailing list
> > Klarinet@-----.com
> > To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> > http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
> =
> _______________________________________________
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 02:39:21 +0200
From: Deborah Marshall <goretitydeb@-----.com>
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <BLU161-w63E66C75372024D3F8A0C5A3440@-----.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-2"
Don't get me started. I lived, played and taught there for 22 years with my =
Buffet instruments.
Deborah Marshall
> From: bhausmann1@-----.net
> To: klarinet@-----.com
> Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 19:35:56 -0500
> Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
> =
> Only meant as a joke (on me as well -- note my last name).=A0 But it IS
> strange that the opinion that the Oehler system is superior seems to exist
> only in a relatively small and concentrated area of the world.
> =
> Bill Hausmann
> =
> If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
> =
> =
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Finn Jespersen [mailto:fj4800@-----.dk]
> > Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 4:41 PM
> > To: klarinet@-----.com
> > Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
> > =
> > =
> > Hi Bill and List! I don?t think that one uses the Oehler system just
> > because one does not want to use a frensh system! As far as I know the
> > Oehler system is required in every german orchestra because it mixes
> > better with the other woodwind instruments and because it sounds better
> > than the Boehm system (more soft). In other words, they have another
> > idiom! Isn?t that ok? Remember that some of the best clarinettists in
> > the world plays the Oehler system, Sabine Meyer and Karl Leister!
> > =
> > > From: bhausmann1@-----.net
> > > Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 13:41:16 -0500
> > > To: klarinet@-----.com
> > > Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
> > >
> > > Sounds like Oehler system to me, nearly universal in Germany, I
> > suppose just because they don't want to use a French system.=A0 :-)
> > >
> > > Bill Hausmann
> > >
> > > If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
> > >
> > >=A0 Sent from my iPhone
> > >
> > > On Jul 11, 2011, at 10:56 AM, Mikko Raasakka
> > <mikkoraasakka@-----.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Dear colleagues!
> > > >
> > > > Does anyone recognize the model of the clarinet shown here?
> > > >
> > > >
> > https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=3D2&ik=3D5e87f981d9&view=3Datt&th=3D13=
117c93c2
> > 50814c&attid=3D0.2&disp=3Dinline&zw
> > > >
> > > > for me it looks like some kind of advanced Albert model clarinet
> > with added
> > > > low Eb.
> > > >
> > > > The photo is taken in the late 1930's an the man who holds the horn
> > is Matti
> > > > Rajula (1905-1944), the solo clarinet of the=A0 Finnish Radio
> > Orchestra.
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Klarinet mailing list
> > > > Klarinet@-----.com
> > > > To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> > > > http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Klarinet mailing list
> > > Klarinet@-----.com
> > > To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> > > http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
> > =
> > _______________________________________________
> > Klarinet mailing list
> > Klarinet@-----.com
> > To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> > http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
> =
> =
> _______________________________________________
> Klarinet mailing list
> Klarinet@-----.com
> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0 =
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 21:17:48 -0400
From: Martin Marks <martymarks511@-----.com>
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: The Klarinet Mailing List <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID:
=A0=A0=A0 <CAOjGvyjvuuGm_WpGJi=3DiQqdwdEjPZ6=3D-HUNSGT6aU=3DRGrfdMrw@-----.g=
mail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-1
My gmail won't open this link.
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 11:56 AM, Mikko Raasakka
<mikkoraasakka@-----.com> wrote:
> Dear colleagues!
>
> Does anyone recognize the model of the clarinet shown here?
>
>https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=3D2&ik=3D5e87f981d9&view=3Datt&th=3D13117=
c93c250814c&attid=3D0.2&disp=3Dinline&zw
>w
>
> for me it looks like some kind of advanced Albert model clarinet with add=
ed
> low Eb.
>
> The photo is taken in the late 1930's an the man who holds the horn is Ma=
tti
> Rajula (1905-1944), the solo clarinet of the ?Finnish Radio Orchestra.
> _______________________________________________
> Klarinet mailing list
> Klarinet@-----.com
> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 03:20:16 +0200
From: corvo di bassetto <rab@-----.de>
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: The Klarinet Mailing List <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <A3780C94-429C-423A-A0B9-21AEE4960150@-----.de>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dwindows-1252
Well, the best clarinettists use historic or Austrian systems of course?(ho=
pe =
you note my mischievous grin)
The Austrian clarinet is much like M?hlfeld's Ottensteiner instruments. C. =
B?hrmann was heavily involved in its development. Adolph Sax, Heckel, Mahil=
lon, =
Krupe, Mollenhauer i.a. contributed. If it was good enough for Brahms, it i=
s =
good enough for us.
Actually, I think Oehler is quite overrated. I own several and some of my =
students too. But the slightly simpler German or Albert system works very g=
ood =
and the great Viennese players (Wlach, Boskovsky, Schmidl, Ottensamer?) did=
/do =
rather well without Oehler mechanism. To me it spoils the forked Bb/f, beca=
use =
though it is still fingered as a fork, the middle key is "blind" and operat=
es =
side keys. The benefit is improved intonation and more even sound, but I th=
ink =
it is boring to drill (or drilling to bore?) ever more holes in the clarine=
t. I =
heard Leister on his full Oehler with worse intonation than Wlach with true =
forked fingerings. Let alone Neidich on his 10 key Grenser copy: perfect =
intonation, ravishing sound in the chromatic scales (Weber 5et). Or Tony Pa=
y =
with hardly any keys at all?
The Oehler clarinet is good for Richard Strauss like the Boehm is good for =
Debussy. Very limited application potential!
I know that many recent compositions for clarinet appear to be written for =
Boehm =
system. Yet when Ib Hausmann studies them, they turn out better on the Oehl=
er =
system. =
Best regards
danyel
(playing on French albert system instruments most of the time?)
Am 11.07.2011 um 23:41 schrieb Finn Jespersen:
> =
> Hi Bill and List! I don?t think that one uses the Oehler system just beca=
use =
>one does not want to use a frensh system! As far as I know the Oehler syst=
em is =
>required in every german orchestra because it mixes better with the other =
>woodwind instruments and because it sounds better than the Boehm system (m=
ore =
>soft). In other words, they have another idiom! Isn?t that ok? Remember th=
at =
>some of the best clarinettists in the world plays the Oehler system, Sabin=
e =
>Meyer and Karl Leister!=A0 =
>
> =
>> From: bhausmann1@-----.net
>> Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 13:41:16 -0500
>> To: klarinet@-----.com
>> Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
>> =
>> Sounds like Oehler system to me, nearly universal in Germany, I suppose =
just =
>>because they don't want to use a French system.=A0 :-)
>> =
>> Bill Hausmann
>> =
>> If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
>> =
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> =
>> On Jul 11, 2011, at 10:56 AM, Mikko Raasakka <mikkoraasakka@-----.com> w=
rote:
>> =
>>> Dear colleagues!
>>> =
>>> Does anyone recognize the model of the clarinet shown here?
>>> =
>>>https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=3D2&ik=3D5e87f981d9&view=3Datt&th=3D131=
17c93c250814c&attid=3D0.2&disp=3Dinline&zw
>>>w
>>> =
>>> for me it looks like some kind of advanced Albert model clarinet with a=
dded
>>> low Eb.
>>> =
>>> The photo is taken in the late 1930's an the man who holds the horn is =
Matti
>>> Rajula (1905-1944), the solo clarinet of the=A0 Finnish Radio Orchestra.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Klarinet mailing list
>>> Klarinet@-----.com
>>> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
>>> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
>> _______________________________________________
>> Klarinet mailing list
>> Klarinet@-----.com
>> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
>> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
> =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0 =
> _______________________________________________
> Klarinet mailing list
> Klarinet@-----.com
> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 10:27:04 +0100
From: Martin Baxter <martinbaxter1@-----.com>
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: The Klarinet Mailing List <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <0FAB1A7A-7FF3-48A3-B623-6998A3159B42@-----.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Diso-8859-1
On 11 Jul 2011, at 22:41, Finn Jespersen wrote:
Hi Bill and List! I don?t think that one uses the Oehler system just becaus=
e one =
does not want to use a french system! As far as I know the Oehler system is =
required in every german orchestra because it mixes better with the other =
woodwind instruments and because it sounds better than the Boehm system (mo=
re =
soft). In other words, they have another idiom! Isn?t that ok? Remember tha=
t =
some of the best clarinettists in the world plays the Oehler system, Sabine =
Meyer and Karl Leister!=A0 =
> From: Martin Baxter, Ulverston, UK.
I have come across several 'Dixieland/trad. jazz ' players who also conside=
r the =
Albert system and derivatives, of which I suppose the Oehler is one, have a =
distinctly better tone than the Boehm. It isn't only an Eastern European id=
ea. =
Come to that the French bassoon, well played, sounds to my ears much better=
than =
the Almenraeder-Heckel; bt I still play that system (because it is easier t=
o =
control and far less fussy about reeds). I know from IDRS that many America=
n =
players would agree about the sound yet how many bassoonists on your side o=
f the =
pond play the French system?
Martin
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 12:38:03 +0200
From: Finn Jespersen <fj4800@-----.dk>
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W125B3CCB1C495C522DB9F9CD440@-----.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1"
Thanks for all answers! Interesting subject, indeed! I tried an Oehler clar=
inet =
in Berlin in november, and was supprised. But living in a country where the =
Boehm system is 100 % dominating I decided to keep on with that.=A0 =
> From: martinbaxter1@-----.com
> Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 10:27:04 +0100
> To: klarinet@-----.com
> Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
> =
> =
> On 11 Jul 2011, at 22:41, Finn Jespersen wrote:
> =
> =
> Hi Bill and List! I don?t think that one uses the Oehler system just beca=
use =
>one does not want to use a french system! As far as I know the Oehler syst=
em is =
>required in every german orchestra because it mixes better with the other =
>woodwind instruments and because it sounds better than the Boehm system (m=
ore =
>soft). In other words, they have another idiom! Isn?t that ok? Remember th=
at =
>some of the best clarinettists in the world plays the Oehler system, Sabin=
e =
>Meyer and Karl Leister!=A0 =
>
> =
> > From: Martin Baxter, Ulverston, UK.
> =
> I have come across several 'Dixieland/trad. jazz ' players who also consi=
der =
>the Albert system and derivatives, of which I suppose the Oehler is one, h=
ave a =
>distinctly better tone than the Boehm. It isn't only an Eastern European i=
dea. =
>Come to that the French bassoon, well played, sounds to my ears much bette=
r than =
>the Almenraeder-Heckel; bt I still play that system (because it is easier =
to =
>control and far less fussy about reeds). I know from IDRS that many Americ=
an =
>players would agree about the sound yet how many bassoonists on your side =
of the =
>pond play the French system?
> Martin
>=A0 =
> _______________________________________________
> Klarinet mailing list
> Klarinet@-----.com
> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0 =
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 14:46:37 +0200
From: Georg.Kuehner@-----.de ( Georg K?hner )
Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
To: The Klarinet Mailing List <klarinet@-----.com>
Message-ID: <3DCF6548-7A50-451B-999A-14156AC8F622@-----.de>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-1; format=3Dflowed; delsp=3Dyes
Dear Bill,
it is NOT BETTER (I play German System)
It IS DIFFERENT.
and there are some "bastards like Reform Boehm - Boehm System with=A0 =
German bore ...
Regards GEorg
PS: There are more clarinet makers in this small area than in the rest=A0 =
of the world! So sound is also very different from maker to maker ...=A0 =
Have look at:
http://web.me.com/georgkuehner/Georg/Klarinettenhersteller.html
-- =
Georg K?hner
Klarinetten (A/B/Alt/Bass), Saxophone (Alt/Tenor)
Telefon=A0 =A0 =A0 06333 - 274614
mail: Georg.Kuehner@-----.de
web: http://web.me.com/georgkuehner
Maiblumenweg 10
67714 Waldfischbach-Burgalben
Deutschland
Am 12.07.2011 um 02:35 schrieb Bill Hausmann:
> Only meant as a joke (on me as well -- note my last name).=A0 But it IS
> strange that the opinion that the Oehler system is superior seems to=A0 =
> exist
> only in a relatively small and concentrated area of the world.
>
> Bill Hausmann
>
> If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Finn Jespersen [mailto:fj4800@-----.dk]
>> Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 4:41 PM
>> To: klarinet@-----.com
>> Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
>>
>>
>> Hi Bill and List! I don?t think that one uses the Oehler system just
>> because one does not want to use a frensh system! As far as I know=A0 =
>> the
>> Oehler system is required in every german orchestra because it mixes
>> better with the other woodwind instruments and because it sounds=A0 =
>> better
>> than the Boehm system (more soft). In other words, they have another
>> idiom! Isn?t that ok? Remember that some of the best clarinettists in
>> the world plays the Oehler system, Sabine Meyer and Karl Leister!
>>
>>> From: bhausmann1@-----.net
>>> Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2011 13:41:16 -0500
>>> To: klarinet@-----.com
>>> Subject: Re: [kl] albert?
>>>
>>> Sounds like Oehler system to me, nearly universal in Germany, I
>> suppose just because they don't want to use a French system.=A0 :-)
>>>
>>> Bill Hausmann
>>>
>>> If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Jul 11, 2011, at 10:56 AM, Mikko Raasakka
>> <mikkoraasakka@-----.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear colleagues!
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone recognize the model of the clarinet shown here?
>>>>
>>>>
>> https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=3D2&ik=3D5e87f981d9&view=3Datt&th=3D131=
17c93c2
>> 50814c&attid=3D0.2&disp=3Dinline&zw
>>>>
>>>> for me it looks like some kind of advanced Albert model clarinet
>> with added
>>>> low Eb.
>>>>
>>>> The photo is taken in the late 1930's an the man who holds the horn
>> is Matti
>>>> Rajula (1905-1944), the solo clarinet of the=A0 Finnish Radio
>> Orchestra.
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Klarinet mailing list
>>>> Klarinet@-----.com
>>>> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
>>>> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Klarinet mailing list
>>> Klarinet@-----.com
>>> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
>>> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Klarinet mailing list
>> Klarinet@-----.com
>> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
>> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Klarinet mailing list
> Klarinet@-----.com
> To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
> http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
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To do darn near anything to your subscription, go to:
http://klarinet-list.serve-music.com
End of Klarinet Digest, Vol 17, Issue 13
****************************************
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