Klarinet Archive - Posting 000135.txt from 2007/03

From: "Hinson's" <bud@-----.net>
Subj: Re: [kl] Bright and dark sounds
Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2007 18:06:54 -0500

Agreed...just a for what it's worth little story. I'd like to say that if a
picture is worth a thousand words...The different tones players make must be
worth more. Dealing with musicians looking for "that sound" is loads of
"fun"...I know techs who send customers away rather than try to please them.
I have a friend in the computer business with the motto, "we don't take no
from a stupid computer". I just keep trying too. Music is meant to be heard,
not talked about. That's the main problem faced by someone like me, who
still occasionally trys to get a fair price selling clarinets online. One of
the hardest things I do is try to write a fair and objective description of
an instrument. NOT looking for more business...have plenty waiting now.
But...the fact is those terms are used and I think techs should try to be
able to produce what the kids want. Maybe dark and bright aren't the best
way to describe tone, but how else can you ? The same player with different
instruments generally sound different, at least to themselves. I've seen it
time after time. I would still like to assert that if you're comfortable
with an instrument, you sound better. It has to feel good to you. If an
artist believes a particular brand/model of instrument is better, then it
is...because that belief causes relaxation, which causes better musical
expression. Clarinets are wood (or something) designed to leak air, and if
any clarinet can be machined to leak it at the right places with the right
volume and flow of air, I'll show you a good sounding clarinet. But that is
just my opinion. I generally read this list and like the way Dan stirs
things. I confess I don't know where he's headed with this, but I'm sure
it'll be fun to read. I still haven't read Dan saying there isn't
differences in clarinet tones. There must be somewhere he's trying to go
with this. The blind nationality test started me thinking he has a goal.

----- Original Message -----
From: "dnleeson" <dnleeson@-----.net>
To: <klarinet@-----.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 3:49 PM
Subject: RE: [kl] Bright and dark sounds

> Bud, it does not matter who she got the term from, she did not
> invent it. She is parroting someone. It is all anecdotal.
>
> Dan Leeson
> DNLeeson@-----.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hinson's [mailto:bud@-----.net]
> Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 12:13 PM
> To: klarinet@-----.org
> Subject: Re: [kl] Bright and dark sounds
>
>
> Wasn't me she learned it from...I can only say she brought it
> home from
> school. I still have trouble accepting it. We've decided that we
> differ in
> the type of tones we like. I remember when she needed a plastic
> clarinet for
> marching band. I rebuilt an old Carl Fischer with a metal insert
> in the top
> joint. She played it for a while and came back to me saying, " I
> hate this
> clarinet, it doesn't sound good." I took her out in the barn and
> said let me
> try it. I turned up the volume and showed her what it could do.
> After she
> learned to play it like a rock guitar, she got along fine with
> it.
> I sold a clarinet recently (a 1932 rubber Conn) to a pro simply
> because he
> heard someone with one and wanted to try for the same tone. I've
> had
> customers send me recordings to find a horn that sounds like
> that. I believe
> that musical tone is so subjective that it can drive you nuts.
> But there is
> a valid point, though hard to describe, that different equipment
> produces
> differing spectrums of sound. I think also that a musician who is
> experienced enough to be comfortable in performance can make
> great music
> almost regardless of the equipment.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "dnleeson" <dnleeson@-----.net>
> To: <klarinet@-----.org>
> Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 2:43 PM
> Subject: RE: [kl] Bright and dark sounds
>
>
>> Bud Hinson,
>>
>> These are charming and delightful anecdotes. I am sure that
> your
>> daughter likes the tone she got from the Boosey, but what on
>> earth motivated her to say that she liked the dark tone? Could
>> she not have liked the way she sounded by simply saying that;
>> i.e., "Dad I like the way I sound on the Boosey!" For her to
>> say, "I like the dark sound I get on this Boosey," says to me
>> that someone told her that it was a dark sound, maybe you, so
> she
>> accepted the statement as fact, particularly if it came from
> you.
>> I presume she did not invent the concept of a dark sound out of
>> her own knowledge, inner being, and experience. If she did
> that,
>> she might have called it a velvet sound, or a vanilla pudding
>> sound. Think about why she used that vocabulary. Who primed
>> her?.
>>
>> That you can identify your daughter when she plays is very
> nice.
>> It's fatherly. It's the kind of thing that warms you. You may
>> have a great ear for recognizing one instrument from another,
> but
>> to suggest that you know a dark sound when you year it, is not
>> evidence. It is an anecdote.
>>
>> Dan Leeson
>> DNLeeson@-----.net
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Hinson's [mailto:bud@-----.net]
>> Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 10:51 AM
>> To: klarinet@-----.org
>> Subject: Re: [kl] Bright and dark sounds
>>
>>
>> I make a meager living restoring vintage clarinets from my
> small
>> shop in NC.
>> My daughter, 1st chair high school and community band, had the
>> opportunity
>> over the years to try many different makes and models of
>> clarinets. I first
>> bought her a Selmer Signet that she still has. When she needed
> or
>> wanted a
>> better quality clarinet I bought her a new Buffet. One day she
>> tried a King
>> Marigaux, and traded her Buffet for it because of the tone. A
>> couple of
>> years later she tried a Boosey & Hawkes 8-20 and traded with me
>> again. She
>> insists the "dark" tone is what she likes and gets from the
>> Boosey. I do a
>> lot of old Selmers for some very good pro jazz players, and I
>> know
>> beforehand that she won't like the tone. She'll say it's easy
> to
>> play but
>> it's too bright. I can take that same clarinet to her after
>> changing the
>> tone by trying a few different mouthpieces and she'll love it.
> I
>> conclude
>> from those experiences that the tone differences are largely
>> dependent on
>> mouthpiece and reeds.
>> When I think of a darker sound, it's a mellow and sweet tone,
>> regardless of
>> volume. I can pick out the sound from my daughter from a very
>> full clarinet
>> section...it projects well, but is without the edge of the
> other
>> players.
>> She played recently in a 20 clarinet section in the all
> district
>> band, and I
>> was able to tell her, and she said later she knew I'd be able
> to,
>> where she
>> got lost in a couple of fast runs and faked it. The brighter
> tone
>> many of my
>> jazz customers want has the sharp, cutting edge that competes
>> with the brass
>> and can with effort demand attention. I have a customer now
>> looking for a
>> clarinet with a "dark" tone...I told her to come try a few
>> different
>> mouthpieces first and we'll take it from there...I can't agree
>> that "dark"
>> and "bright" sound are meaningless, since I have to deal with
>> tone issues
>> constantly...but there should be some better way to describe
> the
>> variety of
>> different tones....soft,sweet,fluid,harsh,brash,...maybe my
>> daughter sounds
>> mildly sweet with pleasing harmonious projection ?
>>
>>
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