Klarinet Archive - Posting 000122.txt from 2005/06

From: <cjarrett1@-----.com>
Subj: Re: [kl] Personal prejudice
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 08:28:23 -0400

Don't you people have any more important matters to discuss that the Pinkie
finger? What a waste of space!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Pay" <tony.p@-----.org>
To: <klarinet@-----.org>
Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2005 7:59 AM
Subject: Re: [kl] Personal prejudice

> On 5 Jun, "Lelia Loban" <lelialoban@-----.net> wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
>> Tony wrote,
>>
>> > > I didn't ever suggest it was illiterate, Lelia. I said I found it
>> > > *irritating for no good reason*, and that therefore it was a
>> > > prejudice.
>>
>> I know you didn't use the term "illiterate" per se, but I was referring
>> to
>> this exchange between you and Dan Leeson, when Dan wrote,
>>
>> > > > This is a personal prejudice and I mean no disrespect, but whenever
>> > > > I hear people refer to the E-flat clarinet as an "eefer" I throw
>> > > > up.
>> > > > They sound like shit-kicking country western singers.
>>
>> and you replied,
>>
>> > > I feel the same way about people who talk about 'horns' -- and even
>> > > 'pinkies' get up my nose;-)
>>
>> For all I know, these particular shit-kicking country western singers
>> might
>> be putting on the same act that Mick Jagger puts on (does he sound like
>> someone who earned a degree from the London School of Economics?), but in
>> the USA, calling someone a shit-kicker implies both illiteracy and
>> stupidity. (Shit-kicker and hayseed share the same underlying metaphor:
>> farming is dirty work and people who get dirty for a living must not be
>> very bright.) I can't stand country-western music, and I don't care
>> deeply
>> about a prejudice against saying "horn" to mean clarinet, but when that
>> prejudice seems connected to a prejudice against farmers (my mother's
>> family), it gets my fur up a little bit (though please understand that
>> I'm
>> not seriously offended, and that I understand that no offense was
>> intended).
>
> Well, perhaps I don't really need to clear this up, but when I said 'I
> feel
> the same way' I was referring to the first part of what Dan said, namely
> that
> I experience nausea (hyperbolically, of course). I don't have the
> 'country
> western' context, and especially not the 'farmer' context, because the few
> farmers I know personally are actually highly intelligent and cultured.
>
>> > > As a matter of fact, on a much more serious note than is justified
>> > > by
>> > > this thread, I think the world might be a better place if it were
>> > > more
>> > > possible to be open about our prejudices, whilst at the same time
>> > > insisting they are not in fact taken seriously by us.
>> > >
>> > > Instead, the world compels us to hide our prejudices lest they be
>> > > used
>> > > against us -- which tends to keep those prejudices active, because
>> > > we
>> > > hide them also from ourselves.
>>
>> I notice that people go through the motions of acknowledging prejudices
>> in
>> such a way as to imply that we're only being modest when we use the
>> pejorative term, prejudices, when we really think they're
>> well-thought-out
>> opinions.
>
> Mm, but that wasn't what I meant. That, and the situation you go on to
> describe, would amount to a 'postjudice' rather than a prejudice.
>
> This is a very big subject, and I can't really do it justice now, as I'm
> off
> to Spain...
>
> But I sometimes feel that being righteous about condemning what we see
> initially as a prejudice can amount to a prejudice itself. That's because
> prejudice amounts to generalisation plus condemnation -- and we are all
> subject to that to some degree, because we're built to have tribal
> instincts
> that divide the world into 'us' and 'them'. For me it comes down to what
> we
> do about our (and their) prejudices.
>
> I'd say that what we want to do is to find out more about the particular
> situation.
>
> Later...
>
> Tony
> --
> _________ Tony Pay
> |ony:-) 79 Southmoor Rd tony.p@-----.org
> | |ay Oxford OX2 6RE http://classicalplus.gmn.com/artists
> tel/fax 01865 553339
>
> ... Misspelled? Impossible. Error correcting modem!
>
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