Klarinet Archive - Posting 000125.txt from 2005/03

From: Joseph Wakeling <joseph.wakeling@-----.net>
Subj: Re: [kl] German sound
Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 13:27:10 -0500

dnleeson wrote:

> A man with a clarinet in his mouth is going sound like a clarinet, not
> because of the man, but because of the instrument. Take the clarinet
> out and replace it with and oboe, and it will no longer sound like a
> clarinet.

Yes, but "clarinet" is not one sound; it is a wide range of different
sounds which our ears (usually) recognize as being grouped together,
rather like we recognize different shades of red as still being
red---but also still being different. (Incidentally, there is some
cultural influence here; for example, some cultures don't recognize red
and orange as notably different colours, but as all part of the
continuum of one colour we might call "rorange". They still see the
difference between individual shades, just not the difference in
fundamental character).

Obviously no one is denying that clarinet players make a clarinet-like
sound first and foremost. The argument is over whether there are
notable biases in what is heard that are consistent according to some
characteristic (like the design of clarinet being used or the
nationality of the player or whatever else you want to look at).

For example, as you yourself point out, if you change the physical
dimensions of the thing you blow into, a different sound character will
result (at least if you change it enough). So it's reasonable to ask
whether there are observably different characters between Oehler-system
and Boehm-system clarinets, or wide and narrow bores, or modern and
period instruments, and so on.

Then there is also the question of whether there are consistent biases
in the way players deal with their instruments, which might produce
observable biases in the sound (e.g. the language influence idea).
Again, it's a question worth asking.

Third, I must note that a lot of what we observe in our awareness of the
world is not a direct representation of what is "out there"; it is a
function of the combination of those things (e.g. the vibration picked
up by the eardrum, or the light-waves hitting the retina) with the
internal dynamics of neurons. So, for example, any scientific
investigation of the different character of different instruments might
have to take neural dynamics as well as sound waves into account. And I
would argue that things such as "phrasing" might well contribute to the
apparent "sound" differences here.

Last of all, I think it's worth saying: at the end of the day all that
matters is that you have an instrument, mouthpiece, reed, ligature,
barrel, bell and all assorted other equipment that lets you make the
sound that you feel best suits the individual piece of music you are
playing at the given moment. And the best way to do that is to have
lots of possibilities and try lots of combinations, and forget about
whether you or your instrument are French or German or whatever, and
just listen. And preferably have fun.

-- Joe

>I will agree that the character of that sound (and I may need
>another work here, perhaps "quality" of sound) is very much
>influenced by the party behind the instrument.
>
>So you see we have some difficulty in understanding the isses of
>which we are trying to speak. This further adds to the complexity
>of trying to formulate a hypothesis.
>
>Dan Leeson
>DNLeeson@-----.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Mark Charette [mailto:charette@-----.org]
>Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 9:49 AM
>To: klarinet@-----.org
>Subject: RE: [kl] German sound
>
>
>On Thu, 3 Mar 2005, dnleeson wrote:
>
>
>
>>I know about Deutsch's work. She is very prolific.
>>
>>One would have to be crazy to deny that there is a relationship
>>between speech and music, but even Deutsch for whom this is one
>>of life's hot button, has not even hinted that the sound
>>character of a musical instrument is affected by speech
>>
>>
>patterns.
>
>However, if we agree that the chararacteristic of the sound of a
>wind
>instrument is greatly influenced by the player (which involves of
>course
>much more than just the tonal pattern), and the the player's
>speech
>patterns influence both the formants that are involved in tonal
>production
>and cadence of the note groups, may we then create a reasonable
>hypothesis
>that speech influences the "sound character"?
>
>It will probably languish as a hypothesis only for some time to
>come,
>though.
>
>
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