Klarinet Archive - Posting 000446.txt from 2004/11

From: Tom F <tom@-----.net>
Subj: Re: [kl] Clarinets - Identification markings etc.
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2004 23:21:13 -0500

On Thu, Nov/11/04 04:26:22PM -0800, kimi wrote:
> Geez Lelia I can't believe what you wrote down below.
> YOu just basically said enough to make me look like
> some kind of monster parent.

Kimi,

I have not participated in this discussion. Consider me neutral. (Or
failing that, objective.)

I find it difficult to believe that Lelia is trying to make you out to
be anything. When she writes "stage mommies", for example, I suspect she
is talking about a group of people she sees interesting traits in, and
*not* about you specifically. Essentially, the conversation as moved on
(at least, in some threads), and you are no longer the subject.

> I should never had
> posted my questions here.

Of course you should; this is the perfect place to post.

> You people are unbelievable
> and you don't know me enough to make the judgements
> you just have made.

Nobody is making judgements about you, your daughter, or otherwise.

This list holds discussions: people find an interesting topic, and
discuss it. Invariablly, this attracts people who enjoy analysing things
soley for the sake of problem-solving, purely in the academic sense.

As such, discussions on engraving one's name into clarinet parts, types
of engraver, which parts are most suitable, and so on, will ensue.
Just because you happened to start the thread, does *not* mean that they
are all applicable - or even relevant - to you.

Just to restate that: if a discussion on "stage mommies" follows, this
does not mean that they are discussing you. It means that they've found
something worth analysing, and are doing so in an entirley seperate
frame of mind.

> I'm offended at how thoughtless
> you are at what i originally posted about.

I suspect that she was thinking not of you, but of the (largley
unrelated!) topics she discussed. I dont think I can state that often
enough (or rather, it cant hurt to overstate :)

> Yes my daughters clarinet piece was taken.
>
> NO that kid DID NOT ASK, she was SNEAKY in doing it,
> she did NOT tell band director her own instrument was
> BROKEN, but instead to anothers. How can you say or
> even imply that is ok.

I stole somebody's marbles once, when I was about seven.

> I thought by posting here just to get advice on ways
> to make sure this doesn't happen again I'd get some
> good advice, and some people did, but others decided
> to rip a mother into whatever it is you think of her
> instead of realizing that me and my daughter have an
> excellent relationship, as well as her being confident
> in who she is, and she had EVERY RIGHT to come tell me
> before she told the band director! I don't believe
> that I cryed wolf or anything else. Since when is
> taking other peoples things an ok thing to do and
> reported said perpetrator to get said item a crime?

Indeed

> So Screw you Lelia!

Best regards,

--
Tom

> --- Lelia Loban <lelialoban@-----.net> wrote:
>
> >
> > Patricia Smith wrote,
> > > This sort of thing is a type of "advocacy for our
> > > children" that is all too often overshadowed by
> > > negative stereotypes of "stage mothers",
> > > which is too bad. Supportive parents can make
> > > every difference in the world to plenty of
> > children.
> >
> > True, but stage mommies invariably do believe
> > they're only being
> > supportive. The parent needs to pay attention if
> > the criticisms come
> > often, from a variety of sources independent of each
> > other.
> >
> > Joseph Wakeling wrote,
> > >All you know is that first of all he
> > [the band director]
> > >had students help to look for the clarinet
> > >part, and second that Kathy *felt* he was
> > >nonchalant once the clarinet part had been found.
> > >
> > >Now, it's unfortunate that Kathy feels that, but
> > >it doesn't necessarily mean that the band director
> > >acted in a bad or inappropriate way.
> >
> > Yes. Kids that age are work in progress and it
> > sounds to me as if progress
> > happened, since the student who took part of the
> > clarinet admitted what
> > she'd done and returned the property. I wonder if
> > the band director might
> > have seemed nonchalant just because he needed to
> > calm down a parent who's
> > obviously protective and intensely involved with her
> > child -- a parent who
> > doesn't seem like some stage mommy monster, but
> > nonetheless may be hovering
> > around the school a little bit too much. I think
> > the band director was
> > right not to interrogate or chastize a student in
> > front of an upset
> > classmate, her irate mother and any band room
> > busybodies lurking to pick up
> > the gossip.
> >
> > Public humiliation can backfire and lead, not to
> > reform, but to hostility
> > and defiance: "If I'm already tried and convicted, I
> > can't win no matter
> > how nice I act, so the hell with you and your
> > rules!" The next step is
> > often revenge against the perceived tattletale.
> >
> > A wise teacher will question the borrower or thief
> > in a quiet, more
> > private environment, such as the guidance
> > counsellor's office, with the
> > counsellor present as a witness and also as someone
> > trained to encourage a
> > student to be honest and to listen. Probably the
> > kid only did something
> > childish, selfish and thoughtless, but it's also
> > possible that she has a
> > general unawareness of other people's boundaries --
> > or she may even be a
> > budding kleptomaniac. The school has a
> > responsibility not just to punish,
> > to satisfy an aggrieved accuser, but to counsel that
> > girl, without
> > distractions, when she's calm enough to *absorb* the
> > lesson that she
> > mustn't borrow other people's property without
> > permission.
> >
> > I've lost track of who wrote this:
> > > You'd do well to avoid it being stolen, sure.
> > But,
> > > how valuable is a plastic Yamaha, if you're trying
> >
> > >to sell it? Is it really likely that, in the
> > normal
> > > course of events, someone will go out of their way
> > > to steal it?
> >
> > Alas, yes. Theft of musical instruments is common
> > in American public
> > schools. My local newspaper's weekly Crime Report
> > lists several thefts of
> > musical instruments from city schools every year,
> > and that's in a
> > reasonably orderly town of only two square miles.
> > The report almost always
> > identifies some inexpensive student brand, not
> > surprisingly, because that's
> > what children own. It seems that often, these are
> > crimes of opportunity:
> > the owner forgets the instrument at the bus stop and
> > somebody else, who may
> > know nothing about music but hopes to get lucky with
> > a valuable, saleable
> > item, takes it home. "Valuable," by a child's
> > standards, might be twenty
> > bucks or a few pills, from an older kid who knows
> > the friendly neighborhood
> > fence. However, theft of a *section* of an
> > instrument would be unusual,
> > wouldn't it? The fact that the girl didn't take the
> > whole clarinet
> > supports her version of what happened, imho.
> >
> > >>If students are permitted to carry backpacks
> > between
> > >>classes ( shockingly enough to some people, there
> > are schools
> > >>where they are not - gee, is that Osama bin Laden
> > in your
> > >>bookbag, Jonny?) she could simply stash the
> > horn-in-case in
> > >>the backpack & continue on her merry way.
> >
> > Guard: Gee, is that Osama bin Laden in your
> > bookbag, Jonny?
> > Jonny: No, it's the crack cocaine I sell at lunch.
> > Careful with my gun.
> > I sometimes forget to use the safety catch.
> >
> > The Case of the Missing Clarinet Part can be a good,
> > teachable moment for a
> > child as she grows toward more independence. Did
> > she try to Sherlock the
> > disappearance *before* she involved an adult? Did
> > she ask the band
> > director for help *before* she went running to Mom?
> > For Mom to confront a
> > teacher makes a reasonable last resort, but a
> > healthy, independent,
> > confident kid will want to crawl away to die of
> > embarrassment over a scene
> > like that. (Are her classmates chanting,
> > "Tittle-tattle baby rattle," yet?)
> >
> > Similarly, a justifiably concerned mother doesn't
> > need a reputation as an
> > alarmist who over-reacts or cries wolf. She can
> > help her child to earn a
> > reputation as a level-headed Liz, not a Tizzie the
> > tattletale or a Carrie
> > the crybaby, whose constant complaints get dismissed
> > as hysteria. The
> > sooner the child develops a sense of proportion
> > (knows the difference
> > between a crime and a nuisance) and learns to sort
> > out her schoolmates
> > without help most of the time (though preferably not
> > by whopping a thief
> > upside the head two or five times with the clarinet
> > case, of course), the
> > more likely it is that school authorities will take
> > any parental complaint
> > seriously and act quickly if, some time in the
> > future, it's necessary to
> > report Piggy Pederast, Dopey Drugmeister, Bluto
> > Bully, or Mopsy Murderess.
> > (Anybody who thinks there's nobody like them in
> > *our* schools needs to wake
> > up and smell the meth lab.)
> >
> > Lelia Loban
> > Defend science. Defend the truth.
> > Defeat superstition. Defeat lies.

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