Klarinet Archive - Posting 000778.txt from 2004/10

From: Bill Hausmann <bhausmann1@-----.net>
Subj: Re: [kl] Re: genuine French Grenadier wood
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 2004 20:50:25 -0400

At 11:43 AM 10/25/2004 -0400, Lelia Loban wrote:
>Unfortunately, I don't have any Bundy catalogues from the 1940s or early
>1950s. By the time of the 1958 Bundy catalogue, which I do have, Selmer
>still made a wooden Bundy Bb clarinet with 17 keys and 6 rings, listed as
>no. 1310. The catalogue says nothing about an unusual thumb key, or about
>plateau keys on any clarinet. The logo on the bell of the 1958 catalogue
>clarinet could be described in a way that would make it sound similar to
>the one on the bell of my clarinet, but it actually looks very different.
>The one in the catalogue looks much more sleek and modern. On the catalogue
>clarinet, "Selmer" appears on top, in Selmer's usual lettering style, with
>a shield around it that attaches to the shield around "BUNDY" below. On
>mine, though, "Bundy" is above "Selmer" and the style of the part of the
>shield that's around "Bundy" is a curved losenge. There's a second outline,
>made up of tiny leaves, around most of the inside of the shield around
>"Bundy" but not around "Selmer." Below "Bundy" is a tiny R, the trademark
>registration claim, in a little loop that drops down from the divider
>between the Bundy and Selmer sections of the shield.

The Bundy 1400 plastic clarinet came out in 1948, for what it is worth.

> Another difference is that this 1958 catalogue says the wooden Bundy has
>forged, nickel-plated keys. I've been under the impression that my keys,
>also forged, are solid nickel. I've just finished going over the keys with
>a strong magnifying glass. I can't find anything that looks like typical
>plate-wear, although the instrument shows many other signs of regular and
>fairly rough usage. I found only one place, on the edge of the LH Ab key,
>that might be a scratch through nickel plate to brass beneath. The keys are
>dirty and I'm not sure that this yellowish mark isn't just a trace of glue
>from replacing the key cork, which looks much newer than the others.
>(Alternatively, removing the old cork carelessly would be a way for the
>plate to get scratched there.)

The keys should be made of forged nickel silver, which is then nickel
plated. But nickel plating keys did not become a common thing until well
into the 1950's, and even most Centered-Tones you see have un-plated
nickel-silver keys. You would not expect to see brass underneath, as
nickel-silver is a silver color naturally.

I'm still guessing you have a late 40's to early 50's instrument.

>
>Bill Hausmann wrote,
> >My SUSPICION is that wooden Bundys had the large
> >.590 cylindrical bore, and the Selmers the smaller .577,
> >but I have not measured them. With the plastic
> >Bundys/Selmers it is easier to tell. If it has the smaller bore,
> >it is stamped "577" or later Selmers are stamped "1401."
> >Large bore ones either have no number or "1400."
>
>There's no number stamped on this clarinet except for the serial number.
>The measurements are right in between 0.590 and 0.577! 5/8" is as far into
>the bore as my digital calipers will reach, and therefore I can't measure
>the bore behind the sockets, but only inside the tenons. The diameter of
>each tenon narrows a bit at the rim. My margin of error in placing the
>calipers seems to be about 0.002, but since that narrowing is consistent, I
>don't think it's simply due to error on my part; and I did remember to zero
>the calipers between measurements.
>
>Top joint, upper tenon:
>0.583 at 5/8" into the bore, to 0.580 at the rim
>
>Top joint, lower tenon (center joint of clarinet):
>0.586 at 5/8" into the bore, to 0.577 at the rim.
>
>Lower joint, bell tenon:
>0.800 at 5/8" into the bore, to 0.870 at the rim (which has a metal flush
>band outside).

Naturally! Of course, as the wood changes with age...

My plastic 1400 measures .588 at the top tenon of the upper joint, .581 at
the bottom tenon of the upper joint. Of course, we are quibbling over
THOUSANDTHS of an inch here. Repeated measurements I do myself vary by
.005. I make no claim of expertise with my calipers.

> Bill, thanks very much for your data. I hope that trying to date a Bundy
>doesn't mean that we're descending into the depths of crankhood, but
>dammit, I just like to *know* this stuff....

Probably, but you will have at least ME for company!

Bill Hausmann

If you have to mic a saxophone, the rest of the band is TOO LOUD!

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