Klarinet Archive - Posting 000451.txt from 2004/10

From: Adam Michlin <amichlin@-----.com>
Subj: Re: [kl] Air flow
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 17:48:37 -0400

At 09:40 PM 10/15/2004 +0100, Tony Pay wrote:
>No, this is wrong. You can have the reed not striking the mouthpiece, and
>there still be a clarinet sound.
>
>In fact, the Germans have a word for it. It's called, 'echoton'. Echoton
>occurs when the reed doesn't close against the mouthpiece facing. (Some very
>open mouthpieces almost ensure that this doesn't occur.)
>
>Alan Hacker once said that 'English' clarinet players don't really have a
>clarinet sound -- it's all just amplified echoton:-)

Being an ignorant American, this is the first I have heard of 'echoton'.

I stand corrected and I will forevermore preface my statements with the
disclaimer "For French System Players Only" and the Germans can just do it
there own way. Just like... they... always... do. Hm.

I am really curious to know how the sound generation works without the reed
striking something (and will understand if I have to wait until you return
for an answer)? Stay tuned!

In regards to widely open mouthpieces, my understanding is that this is why
these mouthpieces tend to require a softer reed, to allow for more
flexibility such that the reed can strike the mouthpiece. I am perplexed
and intrigued by the thought of the reed alone making a sound.

It would be rude of me, the ignorant American, to agree with Tony's
statement about the sound of English clarinet players. So I wont. =)

>Well, we don't, not always. Quite honestly, it really depends on the
>circumstances. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. And the same is true of
>the professional colleagues I've spoken to.

Exceptions that prove the rule, as I'm sure you know. I will concede the
point, nonetheless.

>I believe the way to think about this is to divorce the notion of a staccato
>sequence from the notion of beginning a note.

But what is staccato if not a quickly stopped and started note? My
experience is most people who have trouble with staccato have trouble
starting their notes, in general. Often fixing their starts can fix their
staccato. Staccato problems are merely more obvious because if you start
the note late.. well.. there is no note.

>Beginning a note can be achieved quite successfully in most cases without the
>tongue. It can be more immediate if you use maximum support. But the
>greatest immediacy is achieved by using the tongue to 'clean up' the attack.

At this point is difficult to continue without clarinets in our hands, but
I will try. I will agree you can begin a note without the tongue, but I'd
be curious to see you play reasonably fast staccato notes in sequence
without the tongue. Remember, my overriding goal was to explain why
Bonade's method of staccato works so well and yet is so misunderstood.

My gut feeling about your last sentence is that it is akin to 3 left turns
instead of a right turn. That is, it works, but isn't necessarily the most
efficient way to do things. Why not just "attack" cleanly, rather than
using the tongue to compensate for an unclean "attack"? I will understand
if you feel this is a dead end without use of clarinets.

> > At this point, I must digress for a bit on articulation syllables. If you
> > look at the 19th century French (admittedly Flute)
>
>...and I have to say, that's the difference...

I see, we can learn nothing from the Flute world? It's a good thing I
haven't gone into what I've learned in studying percussion and brass
pedagogy! In all seriousness, the physics of a playing any vibrating
instrument are pretty much universal. The physiology of blowing any wind
instrument is just about as universal.

>It's worthwhile to understand the difference that the tongue position may
>make in staccato. But that's not to do with the action of the tongue on the
>reed -- it's to do with the quality of sound generated by the mouth cavity
>when the tongue leaves the reed.

It would seem to more correct to call it a combination of both factors. The
quality of sound is very relevant to the sound quality of the staccato
note, but the tongue is equally relevant to the quality of start and stop
of the note.

>
> > To correctly start a note is as simple as putting the tongue on reed,
> > applying pressure on the reed to insure it will strike the mouthpiece,
> > increasing the air pressure on the mouthpiece opening and then, ever so
> > naturally, saying "Teh" (or your preferred articulation syllable). Not
> > "TTTTTTeh" (this works so much better when I'm speaking instead of typing).
> > Just the tongue leaving the reed as if you were saying "Teh".
> >
> > This still takes practice, but is infinitely easier to learn to control
> > because the you no longer have to synchronize the air with the tongue.
> > Engineers on the list may recognize this principle as being similar to the
> > problems of race conditions in digital circuits. The principle is simple,
> > you only want to have one variable changing at a time, otherwise life gets
> > really complicated.
>
>As you have probably worked out, I find all of the above misleading.

I do not understand. Do you not agree with what I have written, or am I
being unclear?

>I find it particularly worthwhile to notice how the reed/instrument responds
>to different tongue actions that stop notes, according to what register
>you're playing in.
>
>No-one told me this -- it was something I discovered for myself. Again, see
>the (rather long) article I quoted in the URL above.

I have read your article and will have to get back to you when I've had a
chance to play through your ideas. My initial thoughts are I do not change
what I do from register to register, but I will explore the possibility
that I am wrong.

>You can use a great variety of 'ending note' techniques, involving the
>tongue, or not. None of them is wrong, or right. Only the results are wrong
>or right.

In the greater scheme of things, there is no right or wrong (post-modernist
deconstructionist clarinet pedagogy, woohoo!). I am merely trying to
explain the symptoms and solutions to common problems. If people want to
play with a drunken double tonguing sound, more power to them.

> > See? Playing the clarinet is easy. Just learn how to stop and start your
> > notes. Consistently.
>
>Yup, that's it.

Is this where we're supposed to shake hands and each drink a warm beer?
See, I'm not a totally ignorant American. Just mostly!

-Adam

(Who went to London a few months ago and got to see a rather cool new lower
joint Howarth's is working to convert "normal" A clarinets into Basset
Clarinets. The sales clerk said even Tony Pay likes the way they played.
Luckily for my bank account and despite being overwhelmed with awe by the
name "Tony Pay", I realized I'd have to practice the blasted thing to sound
even remotely like Tony! Sigh.)

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