Klarinet Archive - Posting 000288.txt from 2001/07

From: "David C. Kumpf" <dkumpf@-----.com>
Subj: RE: [kl] Re:Mouthpieces misconceptions!!!!!
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 14:37:00 -0400

Walter,

Your message helps a lot in understanding a major source of variation.
Perhaps all molds are not filled at the same pressure level; impurities
exist in the original material, the mold, etc; the rubber distorts as it
hardens (as you mentioned); and so on. (I'm not a plastics engineer, so I am
supposing some of these as possible causes of differences.)

One approach is to look for different materials. I have not played a
Pomarico crystal mouthpiece, and have no idea what the issues in working
with that material might be. Is glass a good subsitute (aside from
breakage!) and does it allow more precise control? Has anyone tried
polycarbonate or other kinds of plastics? What issues are encountered there?
Do people dislike metal because of the sensation of teeth on metal, or
because it sounds atrocious? (I can imagine both as causes, but without
playing a metal mouthpiece, it's just conjecture.)

Once the material is uniform, and can be expected to repeatedly come out of
the mold with the same characteristics every time, then machining comes into
play. How much does working with the material distort the rubber? (Obviously
there can be problems if one overheats the material, which seems pretty easy
to do with power tools...) And, to what extent are mouthpiece makers
altering the machining process to try to work around variations introduced
in the molding process?

Roger Garrett's original message suggested that he had seen quite a
variation in the tip openings of the Vandoren B45's he had measured.
Perhaps there was poor control in the molding process and so the
specifications for facing length and tip opening are cast aside in an effort
to get the mouthpieces to play reasonably at all...

I just find this fascinating...thank you to you and Roger for helping cast
some light on this.

Dave Kumpf
mailto:dkumpf@-----.com
http://www.optimetra.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From: GrabnerWG@-----.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 9:03 PM
> To: klarinet@-----.org
> Subject: RE: [kl] Re:Mouthpieces misconceptions!!!!!
>
[clipped start of message]
> Walter continues:
>
> I think that we are all forgetting that mouthpieces are made of RUBBER.
>
> Yes, hard rubber, but still rubber, a flexible material.
>
> Why? Well, we like the sounds it produces. We would also love
> wood, and use it all the time, if it didn't warp and change so
> much with moisture and humidity.
>
> Now please consider. Rubber is a flexible material. The
> mouthpiece "blanks" are made from liquid rubber poured into a
> mold and allowed to harden. They are then "machined" somewhat,
> according to the process of the individual manufacturer.
>
> Now, please consider what happens to the rubber as the material
> cools in the mold. Bepending on outside temperature, humidity,
> and the exact composition of the rubber itself, it will shrink or
> change in various directions. Some of these will be so slight as
> to defy any but the most ardent inspector.
>
> (Walter was a manufacturing consultant in a previous life, and
> has toured many facilities that mold products in a similar
> fashion. He has also molded mouthpieces and barrels himself, in
> an attempt to understand the variables introduced).
>
> We are not working here in titanium or steel. It's RUBBER. It
> will vary. We need to reconcile ourselves to that fact and
> realise that "Models" "styles" and "facings" will and DO vary
> from mouthpiece to mouthpiece. That at best, these are nothing
> but guidelines.
>
> Each mouthpiece is an individual, and until we abandon rubber as
> our favored material, and go to something that can be machined as
> closely as the above quote suggests, and does not change after,
> we need to reconcile ourselves to this fact.
>
> I hope this helps to clear up some of the confusion. I myself
> would like to understand why mouthpieces change, and I know that
> they do, after initial manufacture.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Walter Grabner
> clarinetxpress.com
>
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