Klarinet Archive - Posting 000684.txt from 2000/12

From: rgarrett@-----.edu
Subj: Re: [kl] Roger speaks
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 23:28:31 -0500

At 02:59 AM 12/13/2000 +0000, you wrote:
> > > ....I regard my own contribution to music, and the contribution of
> > > my fellow performers of written music, as in one way on a much lower
> > > creative level than the level of the best jazz players; which is
> > > perhaps why I become rather testy on this list and elsewhere when I
> > > feel that what we do is relegated even further, to the level of mere
> > > technical expertise, as in 'making it all seem easy'. We are
> > > creative too, but under a different interpretation of the word,
> > > 'creative'.

The problem here, is that you don't own the definition to the word
creative. Yet you appear to feel comfortable making conclusions about
creative issues. The problem here is that your definition is not well
supported. Therefore, conclusions based on such a definition may be
flawed. Beyond that, what you have written above has literally nothing to
do with the opinion you have presented regarding jazz as a lower level of
artistic achievement.

> > > This feeling of myself operating at a lower level of creativity than
> > > the jazz performer, however, is somewhat offset for me by the
> > > feeling that the end result of the jazz enterprise is not on such a
> > > high level of artistic achievement.
>
>You can judge for yourselves whether the 'comment' has been taken out of
>context.

Based on your standards of "out of context" as presented by past responses
to other posts, I would say your own statement is not supported by your
actions. Using your cut and paste method - well documented in the
archives, your comment is more of an attempt to draw a reader's attention
away from the issue rather than provide anything that is supportive in
terms of actual information.

> > > The best composed/performed pieces are for me on a different
> level from the best improvised pieces.

Spontaneous music making is not something that is judgeable or even
comparable to something that takes months, sometimes years to create. They
are different creative endeavours. That you choose to compare them in the
context that you do is your choice. But the end result is not at all
dissimilar to me stating to the list in front of you that playing a 6 key
clarinet is not as interesting or as difficult as one on a 5 key
clarinet. Or a 32 key clarinet. Apples and oranges. Or better, cat poop
and dog pee!

>My opinion.

Yup. And you need to remember that........

> > More often, I find jazz players play classical literature much more
> > readily and accurately than classical players trying to play jazz.
>
>OK. Doesn't invalidate what I said.

I wonder if it doesn't. It provides a perspective that your's didn't -
therefore being more complete and informative. Subsequently, it makes the
original appear less than valid.

>Unsurprisingly, I'm not going to participate further with Roger in this
>discussion.

We could draw many conclusions about why not - especially after you have
been so dominant in your opinions and discussions regarding other
issues. But the real reason you may not want to discuss it further is that
you may have been caught bluffing about something you know very little
about. It changes the tenor of the "discussion" to one of - why did you
post about it to begin with if you didn't plan to discuss it?

I'm certain there will be a one-liner or two. Or we will see a post that
goes something like this:

Tony Pay writes:

Roger wrote:

>The

and a signature.

But more than likely, we will get silence...........or some kind of "witty"
response designed to draw attention away. But we won't get is a
thoughtful, informative, correct, and knowledgeable discussion on this
subject. You don't do jazz, probably don't understand jazz, and wouldn't
recognize the difference between what a truly outstanding jazz artist can
do with chord changes that come faster than you can count. It's much
easier therefore to try to explain it away as less artistic than what you
actually do.

Bahhhhhh........bahhhhhh...........bahhhhhhh..........or maybe better.......

A straight flush always beats a pair.

Best wishes,
Roger Garrett

>..... I could be arguing in my spare time.

or not!

Roger Garrett
Professor of Clarinet
Director, Symphonic Winds
Advisor, IWU Recording Services
Illinois Wesleyan University
School of Music
Bloomington, IL 61702-2900
Phone: (309) 556-3268
Fax: (309) 556-3121

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