Klarinet Archive - Posting 001243.txt from 2000/06

From: Roger Shilcock <roger.shilcock@-----.uk>
Subj: Re: [kl] Stuffy throat B-flats on bass clarinets
Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 04:07:55 -0400

The single register key on the Noblet bass is in a better position overall
than that on the Bundy - I've played both. On the other hand, the Noblet
has a strong tendency to be sharp in the altissimo register, and I don't
recall having this difficulty with the Bundy.
Roger S.

On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, Mark Thiel wrote:

> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 13:32:58 -0500
> From: Mark Thiel <thielm@-----.com>
> Reply-To: klarinet@-----.org
> To: klarinet@-----.org
> Subject: [kl] Stuffy throat B-flats on bass clarinets
>
> >
> > From: Spiegelthal.Dave@-----.COM wrote:
> >
> > In my hobby of restoring older clarinets, I've run across a phenomenon on a
> > number of bass clarinets which baffles me.
> > The two instruments I'm working on now (a Kohlert and an M. Lacroix) have a
> > similar automatic double register vent mechanism
> > which opens one medium-sized (approx. 3/8" ID) hole (metal-pipe) in the body
> > for clarion notes from third-line B through
> > fourth-space E, then above that note the larger hole closes and the register
> > vent function is taken by a very small hole on
> > the neck itself (on some other models this hole is on the very upper portion of
> > the body just below the neck joint).
> >
> > What I can't understand is the sizing and placement of the lower (larger) vent
> > hole, because these two bass clarinets (and
> > many others I've tried) produce a throat B-flat (using the standard fingering)
> > that is quite stuffy, and frequently sharp as well.
> > To correct this, I have had to remove the existing metal tube from the vent
> > hole, enlarge the hole considerably, insert a
> > larger-diameter and longer tube which extends about 1/8" into the bore, and
> > line with cork the upper part of the newly-created
> > register tube to lower the effective center of the hole and bring the pitch back
> > down.
> >
> > This raises two questions:
> > (1) With the poor tone quality, and sometimes poor intonation, of the throat
> > B-flat being so blatantly bad, why didn't the original
> > manufacturers correct this? Certainly the incorrect size and placement of this
> > vent are not driven by the need to function correctly
> > as the lower register vent, because my two instruments work just as well in the
> > second register after my 'fix' as before.
> > (2) Since (in my experience) the alternate (r.h. side trill key) fingering for
> > throat B-flat is nearly always clear and in-tune, why
> > didn't the manufacturers design their mechanisms to activate this key for throat
> > B-flat (a la Mazzeo)? Perhaps the side key
> > would also work satisfactorily as the lower register vent, in which case the
> > mechanism to use it would be no more complicated
> > than the existing mechanisms. However, I did try last night (clumsily) using
> > the side trill key on the Kohlert as a lower register
> > key, and it didn't really work. Haven't tried this trick on any other basses
> > yet.
> > Anyone else have some thoughts on this situation?
> >
>
> Well of course Bundys and other cheap basses have a mechanism that opens a hole the
> same size and level as trill key #3, but they use just one compromise vent hole for the
> entire clarion register. Also you can't get anything near a B natural with throat fingerings,
> at least on my Bundy.
>
> I'm actually surprised that the compromise Bb/lower clarion vent hole works as well
> as it does on my Buffet bass. I find the A + register pratically indistinguishable
> from the A + third trill key, and I haven't found that any resonance
> fingerings make any difference to it. It's surprising because this register hole seems to
> be very analogous in placement to the register on a soprano clarinet and I always add
> 00X|00X F when playing Bb on the soprano.
>
> It seems that on your Kohlert and M. Lacroix horns, the fact that you were able to
> get them to give satisfactory results indicates that either somehing happened
> to them over the years, or else they just weren't trying very hard
> when they made them.
>
> I also think it would be very cool if, on my low-C bass, I could
> use the extra extended-range length
> in the clarion -- which would theoretically give me a 2nd line G in the clarion!
> Unfortunately, the compromise vent is too big and high, so the clarion goes
> sharp and funny starting with the Bb.
>
> Mark Thiel
>
> >
> > ------------------------------
>
>
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