Klarinet Archive - Posting 001365.txt from 1999/05

From: James Pyne <jpyne@-----.edu>
Subj: Re: [kl] Even Partials (was Bradley's Question)
Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 19:18:59 -0400

Dee,

Whether these spectral attributes (strong even partials) can be measured on
one's home computer is another matter. I suspect that they can. But that
approach would not be compelling to scientists who routinely gather
information using the most accurate measurement tools available. That is
the arena I work in so I try to do it that way, using the best tools and
making careful measurements. I am anxious to have the truth of these data
challenged by measurements that have contrary results. However, to date, my
findings on even partials have not been refuted. So if this information is
not common knowledge among clarinetists I expect that it soon may be.

>FROM MY EARLIER POST - The clarion and altissimo registers have powerful
>even >partials. In some cases showing peaks higher than their odd numbered
>neighbors. The >chalumeau register (especially low chalumeau) shows more
>suppression (not >elimination) of even partials, especially partial 2 and
>to a lesser degree 4 and 6. >However, as we certainly know, the clarinet
>will not cooperate in overblowing at the >frequencies of these even
>partials.

Finally, I have observed and documented strong even-partial content in the
playing of many performers, on many clarinets, in all registers, and with a
number of hi-level measurement systems. I can reproduce my findings. The
results seem satisfactory to acoustics researchers. I'll have to rest my
case on that.

---Jim Pyne

>-----Original Message-----
>From: James Pyne <jpyne@-----.edu>
>To: klarinet@-----.org>
>Date: Saturday, May 29, 1999 11:57 AM
>Subject: Re: [kl] Even Partials (was Bradley's Question)
>
>
>>This is in response to Dee Hays post - Thu, 27 May 1999 20:08:49 -0500.
>>
>>... A goal of research is, of course, to support or disprove previously
>held
>>assumptions. This is why scientific "fact" changes so much over time. There
>>is the possibility that your reply could rely on dated information. I would
>>very much like to know the exact source and date of the article that you
>>refer to. It may be that, in the research arena, I am operating on the
>>basis of newer information.
>
>
>I clearly indicated that this was quite some time ago and that I did not
>have the article in my possession so cannot cite the reference.
>
>As far as the strength of the even partials, what I am questioning is why
>they were not measured sooner if they are as strong as you state. They
>should have been discernable on the most primitive of sprectrum analyzers.
>They should even show up on the simple spectrum analyzer programs for home
>computers. In other words, anyone should be able to duplicate this reading
>at home if the evens are virtually as strong as the odds.
>
>Yes new research can run counter to old research but then the discrepancies
>_MUST_ be reconciled or _BOTH_ pieces of data are suspect. So how do you
>reconcile this difference?
>
>As far as the altissimo A, that's easy. That partial is so flat compared to
>the even tempered scale that you do indeed have to play what ought to give
>you the next higher note. This even works out mathematically. Calculate
>the frequency of A based on partials only starting at the fundamental
>chalumeau note and you get a value that would result from a Pythagorean
>scale approach. This is quite flat compared to the even tempered scale. So
>clarinetists (most of whom only worry about playing in tune rather than the
>mathematics of the situation) long ago found a fingering that gives a
>relatively in tune note. It is this very characteristic of the difference
>between the mathematics of scales developed using partials versus the even
>tempered scale that makes the design of wind instruments a compromise. This
>is why some fingerings in the altissimo give better tuning and tone on a
>note in comparison to others.
>
>Dee Hays
>Canton, SD
>

James Pyne, professor
Clarinet Studio/Research Group
School of Music
The Ohio State University
1866 College Road
Columbus, Ohio 43210
pyne.1@-----.edu
Tel: 614 292 8969
Fax: 614 292 1102
http://www.arts.ohio-state.edu/Music/Clarfest

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