Klarinet Archive - Posting 000163.txt from 1998/12

From: "Dan Leeson: LEESON@-----.edu>
Subj: Re: [kl] Re: Wagner's Ring again
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 16:47:00 -0500

> From: MX%"klarinet@-----.86
> Subj: Re: [kl] Re: Wagner's Ring again

> I feel that a piece of art is a product of its era as well as of the
> artist who creates it. I don't believe we can impose 1998 values on
> 1930's themes (or 1830's, 1730's, 1630's, etc.). I am not saying we
> justify the views: just that we recognize that artists are human. We
> don't have to "rationalize" listening to Wagner's music; listening to
> the music is not an endorsement of his views. Antisemitism and racism
> should never be considered acceptable, no matter what the popular
> sentiment of the era may be. I believe artists who try to glorify them
> should be pitied: it is an example of misusing a great gift.

I knew his views before I stopped listening to his music. His views
on the world were irrelevant to me, as you suggest they should be.

But when I discovered that the operas were a constant presentation of
those views, that became a different matter. I do not need his work
product telling me racist lies, though I really don't care what he
believes in personally.

Analagously, the alleged pedophilia of Schubert does not prevent me
from listening to his music. So Wagner's racism does not bother me.
It is his public voicing of that racism through his art form that
I cannot abide.

See the difference?

>
> -Scott
>
>
> >Subject: Re: [kl] Re: Wagner's Ring again
> >
> >Thanks for your response, Dan. As you say, it's a tough problem.
> >
> >There's not much to add. Except when you say,
> >
> >> Those who deny the truth will continue to do so, and those who think
> >> that the message in Wagner's music is so unspeakable that they will
> >> not listen to it will also continue to think this way.
> >
> >...those of us who wish to continue to listen may be able to do two
> >things, without denying any truths.
> >
> >First we may say, a message that is not received by us is not a
> message.
> >(And surely under any interpretation it would be too much to say that
> >racism is *the* message of the Ring?) We may wish instead to give
> >weight to the unequivocal message of what Wagner wrote in the extracts
> >quoted by Cooke.
> >
> >The other thing that we may say is that if at least one such message is
> >in the music, in the depiction of Mime; and that if Mahler, a Jew, was
> >capable of responding as he did, in writing; then it shows that the
> >matter had far less charge in those days than it (rightly) does now,
> >given recent history.
> >
> >This position, whilst in no way condoning Wagner's racism, does frame
> it
> >a little differently.
> >
> >Tony
> >--
> > _________ Tony Pay
> > |ony:-) 79 Southmoor Rd Tony@-----.uk
> > | |ay Oxford OX2 6RE
> > tel/fax 01865 553339
> >
> >"...his playing soars so freely, one is aware of witchcraft without
> > noticing a single magical gesture."
> > (C.D.F.Schubart on the harpsichord playing of C.P.E.Bach)
> >
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>
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> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
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Dan Leeson, Los Altos, California
leeson@-----.edu
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