Klarinet Archive - Posting 000278.txt from 1998/02

From: Dee Hays <deerich@-----.net>
Subj: Re: Elitism
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:36:57 -0500

Actually you misunderstood me just a tad bit.

Roger Garrett wrote:

> On Wed, 4 Feb 1998, Dee Hays wrote:
>
> > Actually there does seem to be an amazing amount of elitism in picking /
> > recommending clarinets. On the bulletin boards, etc I see a lot of
> > people taking the approach (or students being pushed into the approach
> > by an instructor) that everyone who plays, regardless of their musical
> > activity, should play a professional grade instrument. This is
> > nonsense. That's like saying everyone should drive a Cadillac or
> > Mercedes. And I imagine that most people would balk at buying a
> > Steinway concert grand for the home.
>
> Wood vs. plastic is elitism? We have two people, who are in favor of
> plastic, who admit that they instrument is not as well constructed....and
> provide reasons that support the professional player/educator/general
> user's recommendation, and you call it "pushing"? Give me a break.....we
> recommend what we like for the reasons that we say. I personally advocate
> a Yamaha beginning clarinet with an eventual switch to a professional
> level horn.....with no inbetween intermediate. This is a personal
> approach/philosophy which I can defend with anyone. It doesn't matter to
> me if someone disagrees.....they have their own recommendation and I can
> respect that. But to call it elitism or, even worse, racial bias....horse
> hooey......(sorry folks...that's as vulgar as it gets!).

1. I am NOT the one who compared it to racial bias.
2. I did not say that wood versus plastic is elitism!. But when a relative
beginner (school kids that is, adults are a different story) is being pushed
by an instructor (sorry but that is how is sounds on the bulletin board NOT
this listserv) to buy a professional grade instrument that is objectionable.
That student's instrument probably will be subjected to a lot. Many kids are
in marching bands. Also it is the parents paying the bill and elementary and
junior high students may change their goals in life many times over.

>
>
> > While I do agree that students can benefit from the best equipment that
> > they can afford, when it gets to the point where a high school student
> > is taking out a loan to buy a professional level instrument it starts to
> > smack of fiscal irresponsibility on the part of the person "pushing"
> > these concepts.

> Where is this on the listserv? Where did anyone push anyone to go out and

> purchase an instrument by taking out a loan? I don't see any evidence of
> this occurring......are you saying it happpens on some bulliten board
> somewhere that we don't see? Or......are we talking fiscal responsibility
> and a gripe you have in general? Please make it clear to us.

3. NO ONE on the listserv pushed that. However there was a letter on this
listserv where the writer (who appeared to be a high school student) remarked
in the course of the discussion that she/he had taken out just such a loan.
Whether or not a specific person pushed or not, somewhere this student had
absorbed the idea that he/she had to have a pro horn as soon as possible! Yet
if the person had played their student instrument for that amount of time and
saved the money going for payments, then the person could have bought a
matched set (A and Bb).

4. Yes part of the point is fiscal responsibility in general.

> Who would disagree that this point is good? I just think that if someone
> wants to call it elitism (which you agreed to) or the equivalent of
> racism.....they're really stretching to get some attention.

5. Remember I am not the one who compared it to racism.

6. However when I see a statement that NO serious musician does this or that
and uses that logic to spend beyond their means then we are facing a type of
elitism.

> > Now I am not as rigid as this may make me sound. For example if a
> > student's existing instrument is beyond repair and their music is
> > important to them AND they understand that they are paying more by
> > taking a loan and are willing to sacrifice some other things, then we
> > have a scenario where it may be reasonable to do this.
>
> Ah....I see....let's have it both ways....hmmmm.......what a way to
> present an argument.
>

7. NOPE. Notice all the restrictions and there are more that I could have
included. My point is that the world is not black and white but many shades
of gray. There are indeed some students who know what they are doing and
understand the commitment.

> > Professional players are also in a totally different situation than
> > students.
>
> Exactly what does this mean? You mean we need the instrument more?
> Or...we like it and don't recognize what they need....or what their fiscal
> situation is?

8. Very simple. A professional in any activity needs professional grade
tools. A professional carpenter can't bother with a cheap hammer, as he
wastes too much time and money replacing it since cheap ones break too often.
A professional musician can't bother with an instrument with pitch problems or
whatever else may be the problem on student or intermediate horns. He needs
to be focusing on the music and his business activities not worrying about
equipment deficiencies.

>
>
> I purchased my own R-13 at age 14 years of age....with money saved from
> working the berry fields in Oregon. My parents had no money - I was
> playing on a 20 year old Vito clarinet my dad picked up for $50. I can't
> even begin to tell you how that clarinet impacted on my playing.
>

9. !!! YOU SAVED UP THE MONEY !!! My exact point. And I would be willing
to bet that when you went to buy you made very sure that it was the right
instrument for you since you worked hard for that money. By the way my
parents had no money either. I bought my professional instrument with baby
sitting money.

> Let's try to even things out a little and decide if we just want to
> complain about something, or if there is a legitimate beef here. I don't
> see any of what Dee says happens.....but I would admit that it must
> happen, or she would not get on here and complain about it. But let's not
> link it to the "elitism" charge that was also linked to a
> quasi-racial-bias of clarinets.
>

10. IMHO any one who links the word elitism to racial bias is being sloppy
with the language.

Dee Hays
deerich@-----.net
Canton, SD