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Doublereed Archive - Posting 000068.txt from 2006/01
From: "Geoff Pearce" <oboist2@-----.au>
Subj: Re: [DR-L] re: tinny-ness of gramophones
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 03:37:18 -0500
Yes thats so true about Kell, was a magic player. Now about the European
style oboes - I guess its acquired taste, the first time I heard Tabuteau
(on the 1st Chair Philadelphia album where he was playing the Handel G
minor concerto), I thought Yuk!! - because it was not the sound I was
bought up on, and the phrasing lay like large planks of wood - well that
was to my ears at the time. Later on we had some influential oboists from
the US working in my country (NZ) largely, Hiro Kuwashima (tragically
killed in a road accident aged 26 or 27) then De Vere Moore, Theodore
Baskin, and in later years, John Snow.
My point is, without hearing these guys live and seeing their musicianship
in so many different forms, I might never have got to appreciate the type
of sound that is favoured in the US.
I havent played for a while, but when I do, I like to imagine favoured
players depending on what I am playing - ie Karl Stein for Mozart, Jiri
Tancibudek for central European or French Music, Goossens for many of the
English composers, especially the "pastoral School" and De Vere Moore for
Richard Strauss, Bruckner, and always not out of site is Ray Still and
Robert Bloom. Thats the way it goes. I dont sound like any of them, but
I think the sound and style tends to help mine if I can auralise it.
Yes style ( or in some cases, the lack of it) is personal, but likewise I
abhor the homogeneity of sound - one used to be able to pick the orchestra
by the sound of the wind players (particularly oboists he sez with a little
bias), and it was fun where where were 2 principals in a section (as in the
Berlin Phil) and it was great fun trying to pick who it was playing -
really made one listen.
Guess I am being nostalgic, and on saying that, there are some fabulous
performers around today. The over all standard is incredible, but have we
sold our souls?
Geoff Pearce
Oboe
Sydney
-------Original Message-------
From: herb fawcett
Date: 01/29/06 17:44:53
To: doublereed@-----.org
Subject: Re: [DR-L] re: tinny-ness of gramophones
I really love Archie Camden's K191 as I do Oubradous' K191 and the spurious
#2. Even modern cleaned up CDs don't get rid of the junk on those old
Recordings. I used to have an LP that had some stuff on it that was done by
Kell when he was here for a while. Wow, what an influential clarinetist.
Never could get around the European oboe style,especially the English and
The Dutch. I guess I was "Labate and Tabuteau-washed". Now there is such a
Homogeneity of sound in all the instruments. A pity in a way. Fortunately
Style remains quite personal.
Best,
Herb
On 1/28/06 11:26 PM, "Geoff Pearce" <oboist2@-----.au> wrote:
> Well I had one - actually I believe that a company in India is still
> making them. I had a few hundred 78 records to go with it, including the
> Mozart oboe Quartet (Leon Goossens), Clarinet Quintet (Reginald Kell) and
> Bassoon Concerto (Archie Camden) - They were just some of the great
> recordings I had - sounded fantastic on the old gramophone, especially if
> you sat back a little. Some recordings, just like today, were better
> than others, but in interpretation, but also surface noise. I only hope
> that more are released in CD, BUT - there was an atmosphere all of its
> own on gramophone.
>
> I listen to a lot of modern recordings, a great deal of scholarship, and
> my God, what technique - but sometimes there is a decided lack of soul or
> true "atmosphere"
>
> Geoff Pearce
> Oboe
> Sydney
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: herb fawcett
> Date: 01/29/06 17:19:58
> To: doublereed@-----.org
> Subject: Re: [DR-L] re: tinny-ness of gramophones
>
> We had one where you could use either the steel needle or one adapted from
a
>
> Cactus needle. Wish I still had it. That and the ice box which used a
block
> Of ice, and a wet rag covered the butter.
> Herb
>
>
> On 1/28/06 10:36 PM, "john vasko" <boanerges@-----.net> wrote:
>
>> Keith,
>> have you ever seen or listened to a real old Gramaphone (brand name),
>> the kind one had to wind up, with the needle attached to a small
>> diaphragm
>> from which the sound emanated? I used to have one. It was somewhat
>> tinny and false of tone.
>> I'm sure you did not make your recording with such a device.
>> John Vasko
>>
>> On Jan 28, 2006, at 7:11 PM, Keith Sklower wrote:
>>
>>> Though I agree with the overall sentiment of Shaw's poem,
>>> the lines:
>>>
>>> }I have listened to music from a gramophone,
>>> }It is somewhat tinny and false in tone.
>>>
>>> are fighting words to a recording engineer!
>>>
>>> I made a recording of a live chamber music concert a couple or 3 years
>>> ago of 2 Oboe and English Horn music that was accurate enough that
>>> Yvgeny Izotov gave a copy to his former teacher Ralph Gomberg,
>>> and San Francisco Symphony English Hornist Julie Giaccobassi's husband
>>> has been trying to persuade her to release it ...
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Keith L. Sklower
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
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